Drug puts U.S. troops at risk for blood clots

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/

Paul wrote:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/

as opposed to just bleeding out in the ER/OR.

this is one of those scenarios where if they do nothing the patient
is DRT. you give them the factor, and they might make it.

they might also go on ART status later, but at least they have a
chance.

maybe what they need to do is give the factor, stop the bleeding,
stabilize the patient & their blood circulation, then treat them
with a LMW heparin or some other anti-coagulant to counter the side
effects of the coagulant.

redc1c4,
(there's a reason it's called "practicing medicine".... %-)
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

It's hard to fault the military here. If I'm bleeding to death, I want
them to stop it now and take some risks rather than NOT stop it.

Matt



redc1c4 wrote:
Paul wrote:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/

as opposed to just bleeding out in the ER/OR.

this is one of those scenarios where if they do nothing the patient
is DRT. you give them the factor, and they might make it.

they might also go on ART status later, but at least they have a
chance.

maybe what they need to do is give the factor, stop the bleeding,
stabilize the patient & their blood circulation, then treat them
with a LMW heparin or some other anti-coagulant to counter the side
effects of the coagulant.

redc1c4,
(there's a reason it's called "practicing medicine".... %-)
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Paul wrote:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/

as opposed to just bleeding out in the ER/OR.

this is one of those scenarios where if they do nothing the patient
is DRT. you give them the factor, and they might make it.

they might also go on ART status later, but at least they have a
chance.

maybe what they need to do is give the factor, stop the bleeding,
stabilize the patient & their blood circulation, then treat them
with a LMW heparin or some other anti-coagulant to counter the side
effects of the coagulant.

redc1c4,
(there's a reason it's called "practicing medicine".... %-)
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

I think you are right.. and that WAS noted in the story... if a wounded
soldier is bleeding out...
giving him or her a drug that MIGHT cause problems later on, still can and
does seem to
stop them from dying from blood loss in the short term.

Still having this info out there, lets a little sunshine in on to what will
probably be a contraversy later on.

"Paul" wrote in message
...

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Paul wrote:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/

as opposed to just bleeding out in the ER/OR.

this is one of those scenarios where if they do nothing the patient
is DRT. you give them the factor, and they might make it.

they might also go on ART status later, but at least they have a
chance.

maybe what they need to do is give the factor, stop the bleeding,
stabilize the patient & their blood circulation, then treat them
with a LMW heparin or some other anti-coagulant to counter the side
effects of the coagulant.

redc1c4,
(there's a reason it's called "practicing medicine".... %-)
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

I think you are right.. and that WAS noted in the story... if a wounded
soldier is bleeding out...
giving him or her a drug that MIGHT cause problems later on, still can
and does seem to
stop them from dying from blood loss in the short term.

Still having this info out there, lets a little sunshine in on to what
will probably be a contraversy later on.


I don't know if you saw the documentary "Combat Hospital", but the medical
staff are literally mopping up buckets of blood from the floor each day.
You *are* right that it is good note to some possible outcomes of the drug
use. I will be monitored for a long time because of a chemotherapy drug
given to me 6 years ago which is known to cause secondary leukemias 10-12
years after use.

Come to think of it, best not to read the monographs of any drug that you
are prescribed ... they all have long lists of potential short term and long
term side effects ....%)

- nilita

On Sun, 19 Nov 2006 21:52:59 -0600, "Paul" wrote:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/


The media does it again.

Here is a drug that saves the lives of people who would otherwise have
died - and they want to ban it because a few of them die.

If it saves more people than it kills - we need to use it.



--
There can be no triumph without loss.
No victory without suffering.
No freedom without sacrifice.

"La N" wrote in message
news:n5j8h.12196$_Z2.6253@edtnps89...

"Paul" wrote in message
...

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Paul wrote:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/

as opposed to just bleeding out in the ER/OR.

this is one of those scenarios where if they do nothing the patient
is DRT. you give them the factor, and they might make it.

they might also go on ART status later, but at least they have a
chance.

maybe what they need to do is give the factor, stop the bleeding,
stabilize the patient & their blood circulation, then treat them
with a LMW heparin or some other anti-coagulant to counter the side
effects of the coagulant.

redc1c4,
(there's a reason it's called "practicing medicine".... %-)
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

I think you are right.. and that WAS noted in the story... if a wounded
soldier is bleeding out...
giving him or her a drug that MIGHT cause problems later on, still can and
does seem to
stop them from dying from blood loss in the short term.

Still having this info out there, lets a little sunshine in on to what will
probably be a contraversy later on.


I don't know if you saw the documentary "Combat Hospital", but the medical
staff are literally mopping up buckets of blood from the floor each day. You
*are* right that it is good note to some possible outcomes of the drug use.
I will be monitored for a long time because of a chemotherapy drug given to
me 6 years ago which is known to cause secondary leukemias 10-12 years after
use.

Come to think of it, best not to read the monographs of any drug that you
are prescribed ... they all have long lists of potential short term and long
term side effects ....%)

The troops going to Kandahar have seen a lot of changes in their combat first
aid training. Besides the Israeli shell dressing and new tourniquet now on
issue, the soldiers carry "Quick Clot" alias "HemCon" coagulant. Despite the
risk involved in its use, the CF medics have found that if everyone is trained
and drilled on how to use it correctly, it saves lives.
--
Andrew Chaplin
SIT MIHI GLADIUS SICUT SANCTO MARTINO
(If you're going to e-mail me, you'll have to get "yourfinger." out.)

"Andrew Chaplin" wrote in message
...
"La N" wrote in message
news:n5j8h.12196$_Z2.6253@edtnps89...

"Paul" wrote in message
...

"redc1c4" wrote in message
...
Paul wrote:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/

as opposed to just bleeding out in the ER/OR.

this is one of those scenarios where if they do nothing the patient
is DRT. you give them the factor, and they might make it.

they might also go on ART status later, but at least they have a
chance.

maybe what they need to do is give the factor, stop the bleeding,
stabilize the patient & their blood circulation, then treat them
with a LMW heparin or some other anti-coagulant to counter the side
effects of the coagulant.

redc1c4,
(there's a reason it's called "practicing medicine".... %-)
--
"Enlisted men are stupid, but extremely cunning and sly, and bear
considerable watching."

Army Officer's Guide

I think you are right.. and that WAS noted in the story... if a wounded
soldier is bleeding out...
giving him or her a drug that MIGHT cause problems later on, still can
and does seem to
stop them from dying from blood loss in the short term.

Still having this info out there, lets a little sunshine in on to what
will probably be a contraversy later on.


I don't know if you saw the documentary "Combat Hospital", but the
medical staff are literally mopping up buckets of blood from the floor
each day. You *are* right that it is good note to some possible outcomes
of the drug use. I will be monitored for a long time because of a
chemotherapy drug given to me 6 years ago which is known to cause
secondary leukemias 10-12 years after use.

Come to think of it, best not to read the monographs of any drug that you
are prescribed ... they all have long lists of potential short term and
long term side effects ....%)

The troops going to Kandahar have seen a lot of changes in their combat
first aid training. Besides the Israeli shell dressing and new tourniquet
now on issue, the soldiers carry "Quick Clot" alias "HemCon" coagulant.
Despite the risk involved in its use, the CF medics have found that if
everyone is trained and drilled on how to use it correctly, it saves
lives.
--

Medics and others - at least in the States - are currently in training too
to try to learn how to expand their treatments to make the one hour max
transport to hospital (the one hour window to save a life) to two hours. So
what you mention may be part of the protocol.

- nilita

Paul wrote:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/




Maybe this is all a cover story to hide the problems they're having
with DU poisoning.

wrote:
Paul wrote:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/15790137/




Maybe this is all a cover story to hide the problems they're having
with DU poisoning.

http://eclectech.co.uk/mindcontrol.php