Night Flying. How many PPSEL pilots excersie night priveledges?

I have about 150 total hours now, but my only night flights were during
my training as required for certification.

I fly in the Bay Area, CA I would love to see the beautiful scenery of
the city lights that night flying offers.

How long does it take to comfortabley fly at night and how do those of
you that fly at night navigate in the dark?

Or I guess a better question is what techniques do you use at night to
navigate that are different then how you navigate during the day?

Do you just fly the altitudes that you fly during the day time to stay
safely from getting too close to anything?

I know the easy answer is to go up with an instructor, and I plan too,
but I wanted to hear from you all first and see what you do differently
at night versus the day and how many of you actually take advantage of
night flying.

wrote in message
ups.com...
I have about 150 total hours now, but my only night flights were during
my training as required for certification.

I fly in the Bay Area, CA I would love to see the beautiful scenery of
the city lights that night flying offers.

How long does it take to comfortabley fly at night and how do those of
you that fly at night navigate in the dark?

Or I guess a better question is what techniques do you use at night to
navigate that are different then how you navigate during the day?

Do you just fly the altitudes that you fly during the day time to stay
safely from getting too close to anything?

I know the easy answer is to go up with an instructor, and I plan too,
but I wanted to hear from you all first and see what you do differently
at night versus the day and how many of you actually take advantage of
night flying.

Most of my night flying is at the end of a trip where the schedule didn't
allow us to get home before dark.

At night, I tend to fly higher. That gives me more options if the engine
quits for whatever reason. Also, it keeps me farther above various towers,
which don't *always* have operating lights.

I don't find navigation to be a big problem - major roads, towns, and major
landmarks are still visible. Even better, the GPS doesn't know it is dark.

That said, I don't fly at night particularly often. While it can be
beautiful on a clear night, I rarely go sightseeing at night, because it
makes for a long day. Also, in the winter, it can be cold here.

KB

wrote in message
ups.com...
I have about 150 total hours now, but my only night flights were during
my training as required for certification.

I fly in the Bay Area, CA I would love to see the beautiful scenery of
the city lights that night flying offers.

How long does it take to comfortabley fly at night and how do those of
you that fly at night navigate in the dark?

Or I guess a better question is what techniques do you use at night to
navigate that are different then how you navigate during the day?

Do you just fly the altitudes that you fly during the day time to stay
safely from getting too close to anything?

I know the easy answer is to go up with an instructor, and I plan too,
but I wanted to hear from you all first and see what you do differently
at night versus the day and how many of you actually take advantage of
night flying.


Back in the olden days, when I was an active pilot, I used to love to go up
at night and sight-see. I don't recall much night cross country work though.

I would suggest just going up and spending some time in the pattern so you
get used to landing at night and you get a good idea what the airport looks
like at night. Land without hte landing light a few times to get used to
that too - they do burn out, you know. Follow up with some very local
flights (right over the airport if airspace permits) so you get the bigger
picture. It is a lot easier to get lost since most landmarks look different
(the airport will be thaqt big dark area). If push comes to shove, you can
always use a GPS,VOR's, or vectors from ATC (assuming your battery doesn't
go flat) to find your way back the first few times - but you wouldn't want
to become dependant on that kind of stuff. After a few local flights, you
will get the picture and be a lot more proficient at finding landmarks
(cities, highways) and navigating. (start out in clear weather, of course)

And, as you suggest, there is nothing wrong with dragging an instuctor or a
more experienced pilot (doesn't _have_ to be an insructor, right?) along for
the ride.

Night time can be fun. It's surprising how you can pick out the glow from
cities a long ways away on a clear night. But there is increased risk
because it is easier to get lost and the chance that you will pick a less
than suitable landing spot if the engine decides to stop making noise is
much higher.

Also, I would assume that whatever you are flying has enough alternator to
keep up with all the lights/radio's - but double check. The generator that
had been added to the C-120 I used to fly wouldn't keep up with the landing
light, so if you left it on, you would eventually run out of juice.

--
Geoff
The Sea Hawk at Wow Way d0t Com
remove spaces and make the obvious substitutions to reply by mail
When immigration is outlawed, only outlaws will immigrate.

The only way you're going to be comfortable flyig at night is to fly at
night.

Do touch and goes. Go out 10 miles and return, then 20, then out of
sight of the airport.

Navigate navigate, navigate. On your daytime flights navigate by
instruments, take small steps but be sure you know where you are and
where you're going.

Do stay high longer: descending at night can be tricky, especially if
there's no clear horizon. Eve though you're VFR, believe your
instruments, NOT outside reference, with respect to wings level.

Keep turns modest -- half standard rate is a good maximum. You want to
do nothing that will induce an unintentional unusual attitude.

Get your instructor to induce vertigo, under the hood, so that you
understand without a doubt that your inner ear is not to be trusted.

On a XC, even more than during the day, do a 180 if everything doesn't
look and feel exactly right.

Now, all of that sounds frightening and I don't mean for it to be.
There's usually much less traffic at night, the air is usually
smoother, and sometimes it's magical. There's more -- when you taxi in
between the blue lights, you're going to feel like a complete pilot.

Having said all of that, I can say I did very little VFR at night, but
a ton of IFR in SEL. I just checked my logbook and found about 24% of
my total time is logged as night. Most often I had business meetings
that ran late, and my next stop was 3 hours away: it adds up.



Good luck!



On Dec 9, 1:40 pm, wrote:
I have about 150 total hours now, but my only night flights were during
my training as required for certification.

I fly in the Bay Area, CA I would love to see the beautiful scenery of
the city lights that night flying offers.

How long does it take to comfortabley fly at night and how do those of
you that fly at night navigate in the dark?

Or I guess a better question is what techniques do you use at night to
navigate that are different then how you navigate during the day?

Do you just fly the altitudes that you fly during the day time to stay
safely from getting too close to anything?

I know the easy answer is to go up with an instructor, and I plan too,
but I wanted to hear from you all first and see what you do differently
at night versus the day and how many of you actually take advantage of
night flying.

As with everything else, it depends.
As you get older, you get smarter (or more scared).
Flying at night reduces your options.
Mostly, it depends upon what it going to be beneath you (mountains,
water, flat land, swamps, etc)
You cannot see weather ahead of you, unless it is lightning.
There is often less traffic chatter on the frequency (sometimes it gets
so quiet you have to ask for a radio check to make certain your
equipment is still working).
Trying to find the rotating beacon in a congested urban area can be
challenging.
The air can often be calm because of lack of ground heating and
thermals, making for a smooth flight.
In areas where there is little ground lighting, you better know how to
flying on instruments. I have flown in mountainous areas where the
ground lighting was so sparse, the ground blended with the stars in the
night sky.
I have been flying for 26 years. I have flown one night cross country in
the past 10 years. VFR condtions, over mountainous/wooded/sparsely
populated terrain. It is something I will only do if all the conditions
are highly favorable.
The last night cross country I did last Spring was an IFR, KPBI/West
Palm Beach FL to KLEX/Lexington KY. Conditions were CAVU and I had 40kt
tailwinds which reduced my exposure time over the more hazardous
portions of the route.

wrote:

I have about 150 total hours now, but my only night flights were during
my training as required for certification.

I fly in the Bay Area, CA I would love to see the beautiful scenery of
the city lights that night flying offers.

How long does it take to comfortabley fly at night and how do those of
you that fly at night navigate in the dark?

Or I guess a better question is what techniques do you use at night to
navigate that are different then how you navigate during the day?

Do you just fly the altitudes that you fly during the day time to stay
safely from getting too close to anything?

I know the easy answer is to go up with an instructor, and I plan too,
but I wanted to hear from you all first and see what you do differently
at night versus the day and how many of you actually take advantage of
night flying.

Night flying is good flying, and in the Bay Area it's fantastic (I fly
out of University Airport near Sacramento). More than once I've flown
over the Bay with a full moon and wished I had high-speed b&w film in
an SLR to capture the view.

Consider buying an LED headlamp in addition to a more traditional
flashlight. I find the headlamp great for preflight inspection,
cockpit arranging before starting, and postflight matters.

Start by waiting for good weather and a forecast of good weather
through the evening--no storms or fog. Pay particular attention to
the temp/dew point spread. Start doing takeoffs and full stop
landings before it gets dark, and continue until it is fully dark or
you're tired or uncomfortable. Bring an experienced pilot or
instructor as pax if you are not at all comfortable starting this way.
That's enough for one outing.

Do this again within a week or two. This time you should be more at
ease, though perhaps not fully so. That's OK. Do a short night hop
to a nearby airport that you have done many times in the daytime, for
instance, San Carlos to Palo Alto or Reid-Hillview. Bring a GPS that
you know completely how to use, it can really help at night. Don't
let some weenie tell you that real pilots don't depend on GPS. You
don't want to depend on it, but you do want it as a help.

Once you've flown to 2 or 3 airports in the Bay Area at night, pick an
airport outside the Bay Area, let's say Sacramento Executive. Fly
there once in the day if you haven't done so before. Be damn sure you
have a waypoint or two that is easy to spot and that you know what
altitude you must be at to avoid the BA hills. You might fly there in
the late afternoon, get dinner in the restaurant there, then fly back
at night. That gives you a goal and a feeling of accomplishment. Use
NorCal approach and ask for flight following.

Half Moon Bay is another nice destination. The winter is good to fly
there 'cause the coast doesn't have so much fog. Auburn in the
foothills is good too, it has a good cafe (check the closing time).

Northern California is an amazing place to fly, day *and* night. Good
on you for wanting to become better at night flying. So many pilots
avoid exploring their personal envelope...they're missing a lot of
great flying.
--
No great intellectual thing was ever done by great effort.
Theodore Roosevelt

In article , Bob Fry
wrote:

Start by waiting for good weather and a forecast of good weather
through the evening--no storms or fog.

a full moon is a bonus for night flying.

--
Bob Noel
Looking for a sig the
lawyers will hate

wrote in message ...
How long does it take to comfortabley fly at night and how do those of
you that fly at night navigate in the dark?

Or I guess a better question is what techniques do you use at night to
navigate that are different then how you navigate during the day?


I have had the same question about scuba diving and flying at night from
those that think that diving at night brings out the really big man-eaters.

I have never hesitated to fly or dive at night, I find that both diving and
flying have some incredibly beautiful sights that can only be seen at night.
Most of my flying has been in the state of Florida where I don't really
have to worry about bumping into a mountain, but I do have to be more
aware of my surroundings.
I study the charts a little more carefully for height clearances of towers
and other such objects that stick up into the sky.
But the reality is that if you are flying on a clear night and you dim your
interior lights as much as possible, I think you'll find that you can many
times spot other planes quicker at night because of the navigation lights.

Most major roads are easier to follow at night because they really stick
out with all the car lights and lanes.
There are however parts of Florida that you should be on instruments
to fly over at night because of the inability to distinguish ground from
sky, for example the Everglades while flying south to the Florida Keys.

Given the option, I much rather fly at night than during the day.
But that of course is in Florida, I don't know if I would feel that
way in lets say Colorado or someplace really mountainous with
very few lights to shine the way.

David

wrote in message ...
Given the option, I much rather fly at night than during the day.
But that of course is in Florida, I don't know if I would feel that
way in lets say Colorado or someplace really mountainous with
very few lights to shine the way.

David, et al:

Don't forget that 50% of Colorado is *not* mountains. In fact, from
Golden east is what we affectionately call "West Kansas".
You can follow I-25 from the Wyoming border down to the New Mexico
border and with the exception of the segment between RTN and TAD,
pretty much fly at 9500 the entire way. Actually, lower most of
the time, but COS is in the way at 6200 ft. And going east, you
can do 7500 and keep going downhill the entire time.

It's going west that gets interesting. Rule of thumb out here
is that the only single engine, night, (and IFR if you wish)
in/over the mountains better be in an F-16 (yes, they do
frequently) or a Pilatus.

LOVE IT!

Severe clear after a snow fall, lights reflecting off the snow with a
full moon..

You get the picture...

But... know where you are ALL the time, be ready to get on the
instruments at anytime....

Dave



On 9 Dec 2006 10:40:50 -0800, wrote:

I have about 150 total hours now, but my only night flights were during
my training as required for certification.

I fly in the Bay Area, CA I would love to see the beautiful scenery of
the city lights that night flying offers.

How long does it take to comfortabley fly at night and how do those of
you that fly at night navigate in the dark?

Or I guess a better question is what techniques do you use at night to
navigate that are different then how you navigate during the day?

Do you just fly the altitudes that you fly during the day time to stay
safely from getting too close to anything?

I know the easy answer is to go up with an instructor, and I plan too,
but I wanted to hear from you all first and see what you do differently
at night versus the day and how many of you actually take advantage of
night flying.