Taxi Clearance

I teach my students to call before engine start to get their clearance
(controlled fields). You are allowed to call up to two hours before your
proposed departure, so why waste your gas waiting for the clearance to be
issued?

However, I have yet to ever receive a 'start time' from any clearance
delivery. They just say 'contact ground when ready to taxi'.

Also, if you have a handheld, you can get your clearance using it instead of
using your aircraft battery, so on that cold day, you will have every ounce
of juice the battery can deliver for the start.

Russ MacDonald

"Bob Gardner" wrote in message
...
I think this is aimed at the turbine crowd, not the piston pilots, although
the AIM does not make any distinction.

Bob Gardner

"Ron Rosenfeld" wrote in message
...
I just noticed this today:

AIM 5-2-2. Taxi Clearance

Pilots on IFR flight plans should communicate with the control tower on
the
appropriate ground control or clearance delivery frequency, prior to
starting engines, to receive engine start time, taxi and/or clearance
information.

---------------------------------

In the Azores, Portugal, when I checked out at a local flying club, it
was
mandatory to contact the control tower prior to engine start, even when
flying VFR. (And it was mandatory to receive a clearance to "start
engines" before doing so).

However, in the US, I was not taught, nor have I ever called in "prior to
starting engines" unless that requirement was explicitly stated on the
ATIS
(as it has been occasionally at KBOS).

Is this a holdover from former times? Or something else altogether?


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

On Sun, 25 Sep 2005 00:32:36 GMT, john smith wrote:

I always call on the handheld to get my clearance prior to engine start.
That way, if there is a delay, I am not paying to keep the engine
running while I wait.

The way I've been taught, that is certainly your option. My posting was
that many, including myself, do not do so routinely and that appears to be
in conflict with the AIM.

In the US, have you ever received a clearance that includes a clearance to
start you engine? (which was the thrust of my original question). The
only time that has occurred to me was at BOS and only at a time when the
requirement to call CD prior to engine start was clearly stated on the
ATIS.


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

Santa Monica (KSMO) requires you to call ground prior to engine start.

Ron Rosenfeld wrote:
On Sun, 25 Sep 2005 00:32:36 GMT, john smith wrote:

I always call on the handheld to get my clearance prior to engine start.
That way, if there is a delay, I am not paying to keep the engine
running while I wait.

The way I've been taught, that is certainly your option. My posting was
that many, including myself, do not do so routinely and that appears to be
in conflict with the AIM.

In the US, have you ever received a clearance that includes a clearance to
start you engine? (which was the thrust of my original question). The
only time that has occurred to me was at BOS and only at a time when the
requirement to call CD prior to engine start was clearly stated on the
ATIS.


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

"Lynne" wrote in message
oups.com...

Santa Monica (KSMO) requires you to call ground prior to engine start.


So just how do they require that?

"Russ MacDonald" wrote in message
news:_WmZe.2255$WT3.2244@trnddc03...

I teach my students to call before engine start to get their clearance
(controlled fields). You are allowed to call up to two hours before your
proposed departure, so why waste your gas waiting for the clearance to be
issued?


Allowed by whom? The strip doesn't print until 30 minutes prior to the
proposed departure time.

It is broadcasted on the ATIS. If you do not call for engine start, and
simply call ground to taxi, you WILL be told to hold your position. The
airport is very tight, so they don't want aircraft that do not have
their IFR release blocking access to the runway.

In other words, when you call for start clearance, your IFR release is
coordinated.

Lynne

"Lynne" wrote in message
oups.com...

It is broadcasted on the ATIS.


What is broadcast on the ATIS?



If you do not call for engine start, and
simply call ground to taxi, you WILL be told to hold your position. The
airport is very tight, so they don't want aircraft that do not have
their IFR release blocking access to the runway.

In other words, when you call for start clearance, your IFR release is
coordinated.


So they don't taxi IFR aircraft until they've been released. That's not a
requirement to call ground prior to engine start.

On 24 Sep 2005 19:16:45 -0700, "Lynne" wrote:

Santa Monica (KSMO) requires you to call ground prior to engine start.

But the requirement to do so is, according to another post of yours, so
stated on the ATIS at SMO.

My point is that it seems to be an AIM requirement that is not generally
followed in the US, in the absence of a specific instruction (e.g. on the
ATIS).


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

I think what you are forgetting is that the AIM is not regulatory. From
the looks of it, it is as if you're expecting to get a violation if you
start your engine prior to calling ground. That just won't happen.

This thread has gotten out of hand. The bottom line is that if you
start your engine, then get your clearance, then call ground, it may
end up wasting your time with the engine running if there are delays.
But, no matter what, you will never get in "trouble" for starting your
engine prior to getting the clearance, or talking to ground.

Lynne

On 25 Sep 2005 11:02:02 -0700, "Lynne" wrote:

I think what you are forgetting is that the AIM is not regulatory. From
the looks of it, it is as if you're expecting to get a violation if you
start your engine prior to calling ground. That just won't happen.

This thread has gotten out of hand. The bottom line is that if you
start your engine, then get your clearance, then call ground, it may
end up wasting your time with the engine running if there are delays.
But, no matter what, you will never get in "trouble" for starting your
engine prior to getting the clearance, or talking to ground.

Lynne

It's not clear to whom you are responding, but if you are claiming that I
am "expecting to get a violation" then your inference is completely wrong.

My question, to which no one has yet responded, was why this mostly ignored
AIM paragraph is present.


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)