Mounting 396

Paul kgyy wrote:
I have received the Garmin GPSMAP 396 that I ordered at OSH and am now
trying to figure out how to mount it securely in the airplane (Piper
Arrow)
.stuff snipped

Other opinions/ideas?


I have a Cherokee also and use the yoke mount. I tie-wrapped all 3 wires
neatly every 4 inches or so and formed a loop. The loop is big enough to
allow full aft and rotated travel. The 2 antenna wires split with the
power wire at the panel. The antenna wires go up to the top or the
glareshield and the power wire goes down and under the panel. I hook the
power wire around the side panel lip and route it behind the side panel
to hold the whole thing up.

However, this arrangement precludes you from removing the antennas and
power wire. It does keep the mounting neat and out of the way. Since I
don't use it anywhere besides this plane, this arrangement works for me.

I was going to buy the car kit, however, I find it way better to keep a
$250 unit in the car rather than risk a $2400 unit being stolen. The car
units are better suited for cars anyway (size, weight, screen size, etc.).

Good Luck,
Mike

OK, I have a 496, and an air gizmo mount, which I'd like to put on my
panel. I'm curious to the signoffs needed:

The Air gizmo I think should be allowed to be installed by the
owner/pilot as an interior decoration as long as it doesn't involve
drilling or cutting the panel. Correct? If I have to cut the panel or
drill holes, do I need an A&P signature? The W&B change is negligible I
believe.

In order to wire the power into the aircraft power (not through a cigar
lighter plug), I think I need an A&P signature, and all work has to
conform to 43.13, nothing more correct?

How about running extension wires for the XM USB and remote antenna to
the top of the glareshield with the wires behind the panel? I imagine
that needs an A&P sign-off if the wires are tie-wrapped into place?

OK, and the final question: It looks like in order to fit it in, I'll
need to pull the ancient Foster Loran and it's tray out. That's surely
going to need somebody's sign-off. Does that have to be pulled by an
avionics shop (it does have a connection to the autopilot switch), or
can that be done under an A&P's supervision and signature as well? I
figure I'll replace the Loran antenna with a comm antenna and leave the
end available on the panel for my handheld.

To make a long story short, see your local avionics shop for guidance. Each
FSDO is forming their own opinion on the Air Gizmos panel mounting
requirements and these opinions should be well-known to the avionics shops
of their respective jurisdictions.

Marco


"Ray Andraka" wrote in message
...
OK, I have a 496, and an air gizmo mount, which I'd like to put on my
panel. I'm curious to the signoffs needed:

The Air gizmo I think should be allowed to be installed by the owner/pilot
as an interior decoration as long as it doesn't involve drilling or
cutting the panel. Correct? If I have to cut the panel or drill holes,
do I need an A&P signature? The W&B change is negligible I believe.

In order to wire the power into the aircraft power (not through a cigar
lighter plug), I think I need an A&P signature, and all work has to
conform to 43.13, nothing more correct?

How about running extension wires for the XM USB and remote antenna to the
top of the glareshield with the wires behind the panel? I imagine that
needs an A&P sign-off if the wires are tie-wrapped into place?

OK, and the final question: It looks like in order to fit it in, I'll need
to pull the ancient Foster Loran and it's tray out. That's surely going
to need somebody's sign-off. Does that have to be pulled by an avionics
shop (it does have a connection to the autopilot switch), or can that be
done under an A&P's supervision and signature as well? I figure I'll
replace the Loran antenna with a comm antenna and leave the end available
on the panel for my handheld.

To make a long story short, see your local avionics shop for guidance. Each
FSDO is forming their own opinion on the Air Gizmos panel mounting
requirements and these opinions should be well-known to the avionics shops
of their respective jurisdictions.

This is quite true. We've got our 496 panel docked, and one avionics
shop (in Illinois) said we needed a 337 and a whole gob of paperwork
to install it.

Our other shop (located in Iowa) said all we needed was a signoff,
which they happily (and cheaply) did.

Different FSDOs apparently have different opinions, which means
different shops will charge HUGELY different amounts for the AirGizmo
installation. Shop around.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Ray Andraka wrote:
OK, I have a 496, and an air gizmo mount, which I'd like to put on my
panel. I'm curious to the signoffs needed:

The Air gizmo I think should be allowed to be installed by the
owner/pilot as an interior decoration as long as it doesn't involve
drilling or cutting the panel. Correct? If I have to cut the panel
or drill holes, do I need an A&P signature? The W&B change is
negligible I believe.

In order to wire the power into the aircraft power (not through a
cigar lighter plug), I think I need an A&P signature, and all work
has to conform to 43.13, nothing more correct?

How about running extension wires for the XM USB and remote antenna to
the top of the glareshield with the wires behind the panel? I imagine
that needs an A&P sign-off if the wires are tie-wrapped into place?

OK, and the final question: It looks like in order to fit it in, I'll
need to pull the ancient Foster Loran and it's tray out. That's
surely going to need somebody's sign-off. Does that have to be
pulled by an avionics shop (it does have a connection to the
autopilot switch), or can that be done under an A&P's supervision and
signature as well? I figure I'll replace the Loran antenna with a
comm antenna and leave the end available on the panel for my handheld.

There was some FAA decisions a while back concerning the Air Gizmos in
certified aircraft. I did a quick Google search and couldn't find it but I'm
sure someone here will remember the details.

Here's what Air Gizmo's FAQ has to say about it.

Q: Can the Panel Dock be installed in a certified aircraft?
A: The Panel Dock can be installed in a certified aircraft, but you
will need an FAA field approval.

Jay Honeck wrote:
To make a long story short, see your local avionics shop for guidance. Each
FSDO is forming their own opinion on the Air Gizmos panel mounting
requirements and these opinions should be well-known to the avionics shops
of their respective jurisdictions.


This is quite true. We've got our 496 panel docked, and one avionics
shop (in Illinois) said we needed a 337 and a whole gob of paperwork
to install it.

Our other shop (located in Iowa) said all we needed was a signoff,
which they happily (and cheaply) did.

Different FSDOs apparently have different opinions, which means
different shops will charge HUGELY different amounts for the AirGizmo
installation. Shop around.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"


Here in the Northeast, the FSDO will not approve an Air Gizmo at all,
and the avionics shop I talked to won't install it as a result. It
seems to me the airgizmo itself is a minor modification that shouldn't
be on a 337 at all, and perhaps that is why the FSDO is turning them
down. My local A&P/IA is of the opinion that it falls under the
category of decorative fixtures in the cabin, and can therefore be
signed off by the pilot/owner. I personally think that is stretching
it. Basically I want to get it installed legally enough that I won't
get a hassle about it down the line. If that takes getting a 337 then
so be it, I'll have to go somewhere else to get it installed then.

Gig 601XL Builder wrote:

Here's what Air Gizmo's FAQ has to say about it.

Q: Can the Panel Dock be installed in a certified aircraft?
A: The Panel Dock can be installed in a certified aircraft, but you
will need an FAA field approval.


It is irrelevant what Air Gizmo has to say about it. If they don't
provide the STC then what they say about installation could not possibly
matter less.

OK, forgetting about the panel dock for the moment, wiring a connector
and fuse for ship's power is an A&P sign-off isn't it? Same for
securing extension wires behind the panel with both ends left out for
access but not connected to anything on the aircraft electrical system.
If I went with a RAM mount, if it is a suction cup or clamp mount then
nothing is needed for the mount itself. If it is screwed to the
airframe, then its an A&P sign-off, right? Nothing here that goes to a
FSDO or needs a 337, I'm pretty sure. Someone jump in and correct me if
wrong.

So it seems the real issue is whether the panel dock itself requires a
337, since it seems none of the rest does if the GPS is put on a RAM
mount. Frankly, I don't see where a case could be made that the panel
dock needs a 337 when a ram mount doesn't, but then this is the FAA we
are talking about.

So the other thing was pulling out the Foster Loran. Does removal of
avionic equipment require an avionics shop, or can that be done by an A&P?

Ray Andraka wrote:

OK, I have a 496, and an air gizmo mount, which I'd like to put on my
panel. I'm curious to the signoffs needed:

The Air gizmo I think should be allowed to be installed by the
owner/pilot as an interior decoration as long as it doesn't involve
drilling or cutting the panel. Correct? If I have to cut the panel or
drill holes, do I need an A&P signature? The W&B change is negligible I
believe.


It is a minor alteration and needs to be signed off by an A&P as such.
An owner cannot do that. Drilling or cutting does not affect that.




In order to wire the power into the aircraft power (not through a cigar
lighter plug), I think I need an A&P signature, and all work has to
conform to 43.13, nothing more correct?

Yes. One other way to go is to have the A&P wire up a cig lighter plug
under the panel where you can't see it. That way when the next
latest/greatest comes out you're ready to go. I have two extra cig
lighters under the panel. I have one wired directly to the battery so
it is always hot, that way I can recharge a cell phone or whatever. The
other is wired to come on with the master, that way the GPS fires up
automatically.




How about running extension wires for the XM USB and remote antenna to
the top of the glareshield with the wires behind the panel? I imagine
that needs an A&P sign-off if the wires are tie-wrapped into place?

No, it wouldn't.




OK, and the final question: It looks like in order to fit it in, I'll
need to pull the ancient Foster Loran and it's tray out. That's surely
going to need somebody's sign-off. Does that have to be pulled by an
avionics shop (it does have a connection to the autopilot switch), or
can that be done under an A&P's supervision and signature as well? I
figure I'll replace the Loran antenna with a comm antenna and leave the
end available on the panel for my handheld.

An A&P can do that. You can do all the work, just have him look it over
and sign it off. He'll have to change the placard on the autopilot
switch to reflect that the loran was removed.

Ray Andraka wrote:


Here in the Northeast, the FSDO will not approve an Air Gizmo at all,
and the avionics shop I talked to won't install it as a result.


Why would they even ask FSDO in the first place? Don't they know how to
read?



It
seems to me the airgizmo itself is a minor modification that shouldn't
be on a 337 at all, and perhaps that is why the FSDO is turning them
down.


Bingo.