In-Flight Weather / GPS

I've searched the threads on Google, but given the emerging technologies
involved, I'd be interested in any thoughts or recent experience that
anyone can provide regarding the in-flight satellite weather in
particular.

We have a Cherokee with StrikeFinder (which works to avoid the big
stuff) and a handheld Garmin GPSMAP 195 (which is a fine GPS), but we've
been considering the added benefit of in-flight weather uplink.

I see that the AnywhereMap folks have an iPaq 4700-based system that
uses Bluetooth for connectivity between the receivers (both XM and GPS)
and the iPaq, but I am unsure about whether the iPaq will be adequately
sized (though it is yoke-mountable). I am also concerned about the
practicality of this system due to the small size of the PDA and the
battery life of the units involved.

The other option that we were considering is WxWorx on a Tablet PC.
This route would be more expensive because of the Tablet PC, but the
advantage would be that we could use the Tablet PC for other things, and
it would provide a much larger screen and easier targets to hit with the
pen in flight. I am not sure if the AnywhereMap folks have software
that will work on a Tablet PC, but they only appear to sell the PocketPC
bundles. I'm unclear on what WxWorx can provide other than the weather,
and how the GPS mapping functionality compares to AnywhereMap.

Or, we could just bag the whole thing right now and land when we
encounter questionable conditions, and continue to rely on the GPSMAP
195 for situational awareness. I'm not sure how much improved the GPS
functions of a PDA-based system would be, or whether in-flight weather
is worth the investment at this point.



Thanks,
JKG

"Jonathan Goodish" wrote:
I'm unclear on what WxWorx can provide other than the weather,
and how the GPS mapping functionality compares to AnywhereMap.

If you get the WxWorx premium map package and plug a USB gps into the
tablet pc, you get a very useful moving map with METARs, TAFs, cloud
tops, winds aloft, lightning strikes and NEXRAD. Fabulous.

Or, we could just bag the whole thing right now and land when we
encounter questionable conditions,

I used to do that. I'd sure hate to go back to flying weather-blind.

I'm not sure how much improved the GPS
functions of a PDA-based system would be, or whether in-flight weather
is worth the investment at this point.

I'm sure you can guess what my recommendation would be.
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

In article ,
"Dan Luke" wrote:

"Jonathan Goodish" wrote:
I'm unclear on what WxWorx can provide other than the weather,
and how the GPS mapping functionality compares to AnywhereMap.

If you get the WxWorx premium map package and plug a USB gps into the
tablet pc, you get a very useful moving map with METARs, TAFs, cloud
tops, winds aloft, lightning strikes and NEXRAD. Fabulous.


Weather is the primary reason that we're considering this at all.
However, how does the WxWorx + map package compare to Control Vision's
AnywhereWX + AnywhereMap products? The latter seem to be focused
primarily on the PDA segment, although they do have a XP product that
presumably works on a TabletPC.

And, is their an approach plates option with the WxWorx system? If
we're going to do this, being able to ditch the paper subscriptions
would help with the justification.



Thanks,
JKG

"Jonathan Goodish" wrote:
Weather is the primary reason that we're considering this at all.
However, how does the WxWorx + map package compare to Control Vision's
AnywhereWX + AnywhereMap products?

I'm not familiar enough with Control Vision's stuff to offer you a
comparison.

And, is their an approach plates option with the WxWorx system?

I think these folks put it all together:
http://flightdeck.aero/products.asp or
http://www.navaero.com/t_pad/software_access.asp

If
we're going to do this, being able to ditch the paper subscriptions
would help with the justification.

If you use your airplane for travel, the weather features alone are
justification enough, IMO.
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

If your hobby and interests are computers and electronic gadgets, then
these systems are probably fascinating - but you really need two
pilots, one to stare at the gadgets and the other to look outside and
fly the airplane... But, if you actually fly for the love of aviating
they add little to nothing to your trip(s) and will cost significant
amounts of money to buy and to operate... The clutter in the cockpit
will be considerable with power cords/data cords to the screen, GPS,
etc...

In a few days we will air tour from Michigan to New Orleans, the gulf
coast of Florida down to Key West, then back up the atlantic coast to
the Carolinas and back to Michigan - in excess of 3000 air miles...
Weather briefings will had from Flight Service... Primary nav will be
Howie Keefe's Air Chart and MK-I eyeballs... Secondary nav will be
VOR/DME and 196/195 for avoiding restricted airspace; and if IFR/IMC is
encountered...... Works for me...

denny

In article . com,
"Denny" wrote:
If your hobby and interests are computers and electronic gadgets, then
these systems are probably fascinating - but you really need two
pilots, one to stare at the gadgets and the other to look outside and
fly the airplane... But, if you actually fly for the love of aviating
they add little to nothing to your trip(s) and will cost significant
amounts of money to buy and to operate... The clutter in the cockpit
will be considerable with power cords/data cords to the screen, GPS,
etc...


I'm not looking for a toy, I'm looking for something that is worth the
money... because I'm ultra-cheap when it comes to this kind of stuff.
Obviously, I'm not convinced that it's worth it yet.

I will say that I think reliable weather service is worth a tremendous
amount if you fly IFR. I'm sorry, but in my experience flight service
is NOT reliable in the air. It took me 10 minutes on the right
frequency just to get a response from FSS/Fligh****ch on the radio, and
when I asked for winds aloft, I got surface winds... so then I had to
ask again. That all happened on a CAVU day; I can't imagine what kind
of service I would have received if the weather was down the tubes.

What I don't know is whether the XM weather on a PDA is practical enough
to warrant the money, because if I talk TabletPC, I'm talking a lot more
money for something that I probably don't need. Based on my research,
WxWorx on the Tablet looks more impressive than, say, AnywhereWx on the
PDA, but I doubt that an online photo does either product justice.



JKG

"Denny" wrote:
If your hobby and interests are computers and electronic gadgets, then
these systems are probably fascinating - but you really need two
pilots, one to stare at the gadgets and the other to look outside and
fly the airplane... But, if you actually fly for the love of aviating
they add little to nothing to your trip(s)

Nuts.

If you use a light airplane for regular travel down South, having live
NEXRAD aboard is the greatest thing since flaps.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

Jon and Dan, needs and wants are perceived items... So, your and my
needs and wants are likely to be different... Gadgets are nice... I was
an early adopter of GPS, buying the manufacturer's prototype unit, on
display at Oshkosh, the PRONAV 100 (later became the Garmin 100) the
year they came out... I used that unit (with help from MU2 Mike, Thanks
Mike!) until just recently when it died for the second and final
time... Currently I have a 195 and a 196 on the yokes... I have looked
at the various panel mount units up through the WAAS enabled stuff, but
I don't see enough improvement in-flight to justify the cost... A VFR
GPS and a VOR/ILS/DME gets me where I need to be 99% of the time, at
minimum expense... If they shut down Flight Service tomorrow then I
will buy the latest and greatest in in-flight WEATHER / WAAS GPS / COM
/ NAV / AUTOPILOT / COFFEE DISPENSER mounted in the panel...

cheers ... denny

BTW, Flight service is dependent upon the person and the work load...
If they are hammered then you will have to wait your turn... I have to
say that over some four decades of using them actively that they are
always there when I really need them...

"Denny" wrote:
your and my needs and wants are likely to be different...

Just so, Denny. But that's quite a different tone than "But, if you
actually fly for the love of aviating [weather displays] add little to
nothing to your trip."

I have looked at the various panel mount units up through the
WAAS enabled stuff, but I don't see enough improvement
in-flight to justify the cost...

Your and my needs and wants are likely to be different.

For Angel Flight missions, I have found an approach certified GPS
necessary. On two occasions the missions simply couldn't have been
completed without it. As far as XM weather gear I use is concerned,
there have been missions I wouldn't even have attempted without it.

BTW, Flight service is dependent upon the person and the work load...
If they are hammered then you will have to wait your turn... I have to
say that over some four decades of using them actively that they are
always there when I really need them...

Same here (well, only 0.8 decades). But new technology has made trying
to find a way across 300 miles of blooming CBs using eyeballs and
Fligh****ch more challenging--and dangerous-- than necessary. It's
really no different than your use of GPS to stay out of R- areas: it's
just a better way than we used to have.
--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

In article .com,
"Denny" wrote:

Jon and Dan, needs and wants are perceived items... So, your and my
needs and wants are likely to be different... Gadgets are nice... I was
an early adopter of GPS, buying the manufacturer's prototype unit, on
display at Oshkosh, the PRONAV 100 (later became the Garmin 100) the
year they came out... I used that unit (with help from MU2 Mike, Thanks
Mike!) until just recently when it died for the second and final
time... Currently I have a 195 and a 196 on the yokes... I have looked
at the various panel mount units up through the WAAS enabled stuff, but
I don't see enough improvement in-flight to justify the cost... A VFR
GPS and a VOR/ILS/DME gets me where I need to be 99% of the time, at
minimum expense... If they shut down Flight Service tomorrow then I
will buy the latest and greatest in in-flight WEATHER / WAAS GPS / COM
/ NAV / AUTOPILOT / COFFEE DISPENSER mounted in the panel...


I agree that, so far that I've seen, there's nothing super-compelling
about the PDA or Tablet GPS capability over the GPSMAP 195 that I have
now. In fact, I'm more confident in the performance of the 195 than a
Windows-based software package.

The big deal for me is the weather. My wife and I are IFR pilots who
make every attempt to stay out of IMC, but sometimes it isn't possible.
When I need to know what's going on up ahead and make a decision on
where to go to get around it, request new clearances, etc., I don't have
10 minutes to wait on flight service to tell me what their
interpretation is, and then another 10 minutes for the controller who's
swamped to tell me whether he can give me the amended clearance or not.
If I get a new route that's different than the one that I requested, I
now may have to go back to flight service to find out what kind of fun
I'm in for on my new route.

I guess it comes down to what type of flying you do or intend to do. If
you can take your time, be extra-conservative, and relaxed in going from
point A to B, you probably don't need the weather. My wife and I find
it difficult to find time for vacation, so when we decide to go, we need
to go, as long as things are nuts. We won't make a flight unless we are
confident that we can make it safely, and the weather may equip us to
make a better decision one way or the other.

I also set out on this project to determine the practicality of giving
up paper charts and plates for something electronic. Even on a Tablet,
I'm not sure that the flight planning/electronic charting stuff is up to
snuff quite yet. I'm sure Jepp's package is great, but Jepp charges a
premium for perks that I just don't need. If I don't use the system for
GPS and I don't use it for charts, all of a sudden I end up with a very
expensive system for in-flight weather. Is it worth it? I don't yet
know. I think I'll have to bug some local pilots to see their
installations before I'm convinced.


JKG