Hurricane relief

"Bob Noel" wrote:

ouch. I hope it goes well for you.

Thanks.

Maybe other pilots in the area would be willing to fly it for ya. :-)

Ha! I'm sure.

Not only can I not fly my airplane, I'm missing the chance to fly my
buddy Lamar's Mooney while he's gone.

This really sucks.

--
Dan
C172RG at BFM

"cjcampbell" writes:
[snip]
Speaking of which, Seattle once was below sea level like New Orleans.
Instead of levees to keep water out, though, early Seattlites just used
boats to navigate streets when the tide was in. After the great Seattle
Fire, though, the rubble and material from some neighboring hills was
used to raise the level of the whole city. I wonder how much of the
rubble from Katrina could be used for that in New Orleans, assuming it
is not all too contaminated to be useful? Biloxi, Slidell, and several
smaller towns have an awful lot of garbage they are going to have to
find a home for.

I was thinking about the recovery/restoration effort for
New Orleans and realized that using NO as a landfill site
would solve several problems at once.

Trying to restore NO to the way it was before Katrina
makes no sense and expending copious resources to try to
"improve" things will only move the same basic problems
to the next time. If you build a city in a hole in the
ocean, you have to expect major problems from time to
time. Building bans are in place in other parts of the
Mississippi River floodplain...

"Happy Dog" wrote in message
...
"Gary Drescher" wrote in
Look at it this way: in my experience, most pilots do not routinely carry
expensive, extensive survival gear when they fly. Instead, at best, they
file flight plans and rely on being rescued if they survive a crash.

At best? Your evidence of this? Most I know carry equipment appropriate
to the area their flying in.

I don't have evidence about the practices of pilots generally, which is why
I carefully restricted the scope of my remark to pilots "in my experience".
That is, among pilots I know, there are few if any who, when they make
cross-country flights, carry extra food, water, medical supplies, or other
equipment found in a standard hundred-dollar survival kit. (I myself carry
just a compass, rescue whistle, signal mirror, rope, and aluminum blankets.)

Yes, I consider this equipment appropriate to the area I'm flying in--but
only *because* I'd expect to be rescued promptly (at least within a couple
of days, even in a large wooded area, and probably much sooner). If I
couldn't reasonably rely on being rescued, I'd have to go to much more
expense to be much better prepared.

--Gary

"Gary Drescher" wrote in
"Happy Dog" wrote in message
...
"Gary Drescher" wrote in
Look at it this way: in my experience, most pilots do not routinely
carry expensive, extensive survival gear when they fly. Instead, at
best, they file flight plans and rely on being rescued if they survive a
crash.

At best? Your evidence of this? Most I know carry equipment appropriate
to the area their flying in.

I don't have evidence about the practices of pilots generally, which is
why I carefully restricted the scope of my remark to pilots "in my
experience". That is, among pilots I know, there are few if any who, when
they make cross-country flights, carry extra food, water, medical
supplies, or other equipment found in a standard hundred-dollar survival
kit. (I myself carry just a compass, rescue whistle, signal mirror, rope,
and aluminum blankets.)

Yes, I consider this equipment appropriate to the area I'm flying in--but
only *because* I'd expect to be rescued promptly (at least within a couple
of days, even in a large wooded area, and probably much sooner). If I
couldn't reasonably rely on being rescued, I'd have to go to much more
expense to be much better prepared.

So what's your point? And how does it relate to your views on the current
topic? You seem to be backing my point that many victims are to blame for
their current situation just as you would be if you failed to properly
prepare for a flight. You feeling OK?

moo

Gary Drescher wrote:
Yes, I consider this equipment appropriate to the area I'm flying in--but
only *because* I'd expect to be rescued promptly (at least within a couple
of days, even in a large wooded area, and probably much sooner). If I
couldn't reasonably rely on being rescued, I'd have to go to much more
expense to be much better prepared.

There is a paper on an FAA website that I cited last year.
A reseacher studied rescues based on the time an ELT signal was received
by the satellite until the time until rescue was effected.
Three days is the average.

"Happy Dog" wrote in message
...
"Gary Drescher" wrote in
I don't have evidence about the practices of pilots generally, which is
why I carefully restricted the scope of my remark to pilots "in my
experience". That is, among pilots I know, there are few if any who, when
they make cross-country flights, carry extra food, water, medical
supplies, or other equipment found in a standard hundred-dollar survival
kit. (I myself carry just a compass, rescue whistle, signal mirror, rope,
and aluminum blankets.)

Yes, I consider this equipment appropriate to the area I'm flying in--but
only *because* I'd expect to be rescued promptly (at least within a
couple of days, even in a large wooded area, and probably much sooner).
If I couldn't reasonably rely on being rescued, I'd have to go to much
more expense to be much better prepared.

So what's your point? And how does it relate to your views on the current
topic? You seem to be backing my point that many victims are to blame for
their current situation just as you would be if you failed to properly
prepare for a flight. You feeling OK?

Fine, thanks. No, my point is that I believe I *am* preparing adequately for
my flights (as are the many other pilots who prepare similarly). But that
adequateness *depends*--perfectly reasonably--on the expectation that the
SAR apparatus will work more or less as it is supposed to. That same
expectation, on the part of the hurricane victims, is disparaged by some as
a "gimme mentality" that successful, responsible individuals wouldn't
exhibit.

In the Katrina crisis, preliminary indications are that the rescue apparatus
did *not* do its job initially, despite a supposedly unprecedented level of
disaster-relief preparedness. Part of its job was to deploy the National
Guard in a timely fashion to establish order and protect other rescuers.
Because the fact is that a dissipation of civil authority frequently
precipitates violence by some; this has happened throughout the world and
throughout human history, so it should take no one by surprise. Nor should
it be misrepresented as unusually characteristic of impoverished people or
welfare recipients; sadly, it is universal.

--Gary

"john smith" wrote in message
. ..
Gary Drescher wrote:
Yes, I consider this equipment appropriate to the area I'm flying in--but
only *because* I'd expect to be rescued promptly (at least within a
couple of days, even in a large wooded area, and probably much sooner).
If I couldn't reasonably rely on being rescued, I'd have to go to much
more expense to be much better prepared.

There is a paper on an FAA website that I cited last year.
A reseacher studied rescues based on the time an ELT signal was received
by the satellite until the time until rescue was effected.
Three days is the average.

I suspect that average may be jacked up by more challenging terrain than I
usually overfly here in the Northeast. But perhaps I'm being too optimistic.

--Gary

"Gary Drescher" wrote in
So what's your point? And how does it relate to your views on the
current topic? You seem to be backing my point that many victims are to
blame for their current situation just as you would be if you failed to
properly prepare for a flight. You feeling OK?

Fine, thanks. No, my point is that I believe I *am* preparing adequately
for my flights (as are the many other pilots who prepare similarly). But
that adequateness *depends*--perfectly reasonably--on the expectation that
the SAR apparatus will work more or less as it is supposed to. That same
expectation, on the part of the hurricane victims, is disparaged by some
as a "gimme mentality" that successful, responsible individuals wouldn't
exhibit.

People were told to evacuate. The information necessary for anyone with a
grade five education to understand the magnitude of the potential ****ing
the region was possibly, even likely, in for was made available. Many
foolishly stayed. They have themselves to blame. Don't fly near
thunderstorms. Your analogy sucks. Get it?

In the Katrina crisis, preliminary indications are that the rescue
apparatus did *not* do its job initially, despite a supposedly
unprecedented level of disaster-relief preparedness. Part of its job was
to deploy the National Guard in a timely fashion to establish order and
protect other rescuers. Because the fact is that a dissipation of civil
authority frequently precipitates violence by some;

The widespread violence at the shelters and the massive looting campaign
were due to the "dissipation of civil authority"?

BWAHAHAHAHA!

this has happened throughout the world and throughout human history, so it
should take no one by surprise. Nor should it be misrepresented as
unusually characteristic of impoverished people or welfare recipients;
sadly, it is universal.

Well, we can disagree then and wait for the facts to reveal themselves. I
haven't enough faith in newspaper reports to use them as solid evidence.
But, FWIW, from the reports so far, you're losing badly.

moo

In article ,
"Gary Drescher" wrote:

equipment found in a standard hundred-dollar survival kit. (I myself carry
just a compass, rescue whistle, signal mirror , rope, and . . .


Reading this led me to think back to the discussion some months ago of
laser dazzling incidents involving pilots.

My impression is that even a cheapo ballpoint-pen-sized 5 mW red laser
pointer ($20 variety), while absolutely no threat at any range, could
function as a very effective emergency signal light for a downed pilot
(or lost hiker or skier or . . . ) if they could point it at or close to
a search aircraft, at slant ranges up to ???several miles???, surely at
night, probably even in the daytime.

And one of the more expensive green versions ($100-$200 price range)
would be immensely more effective in the same situation, since the human
eye is much, much more sensitive at its wavelength.

In other words, either one might be essentially as effective as the
search mirror even with the sun out, and immensely more effective on
cloudy days or at night, at about the same weight and not a lot more
cost.

Of course if you really wanted to exploit this technology you'd have
pilots, hikers, etc, carry either type of laser pointer and observers in
the search planes wear special sunglasses that were close to opaque
across the visible, except for a notch-filter passband at the laser
wavelength. Assuming that the individual being searched for was able to
point the pointer at the search plane, or scan its beam across the
search plane, that signal would be near impossible to miss visually.

Anyone know if anything like this is in regular use?

"Happy Dog" wrote in message
...
"Gary Drescher" wrote in
So what's your point? And how does it relate to your views on the
current topic? You seem to be backing my point that many victims are to
blame for their current situation just as you would be if you failed to
properly prepare for a flight. You feeling OK?

Fine, thanks. No, my point is that I believe I *am* preparing adequately
for my flights (as are the many other pilots who prepare similarly). But
that adequateness *depends*--perfectly reasonably--on the expectation
that the SAR apparatus will work more or less as it is supposed to. That
same expectation, on the part of the hurricane victims, is disparaged by
some as a "gimme mentality" that successful, responsible individuals
wouldn't exhibit.

People were told to evacuate. The information necessary for anyone with a
grade five education to understand the magnitude of the potential ****ing
the region was possibly, even likely, in for was made available. Many
foolishly stayed. They have themselves to blame. Don't fly near
thunderstorms. Your analogy sucks. Get it?

In the Katrina crisis, preliminary indications are that the rescue
apparatus did *not* do its job initially, despite a supposedly
unprecedented level of disaster-relief preparedness. Part of its job was
to deploy the National Guard in a timely fashion to establish order and
protect other rescuers. Because the fact is that a dissipation of civil
authority frequently precipitates violence by some;

The widespread violence at the shelters and the massive looting campaign
were due to the "dissipation of civil authority"?

BWAHAHAHAHA!

this has happened throughout the world and throughout human history, so
it should take no one by surprise. Nor should it be misrepresented as
unusually characteristic of impoverished people or welfare recipients;
sadly, it is universal.

Well, we can disagree then and wait for the facts to reveal themselves. I
haven't enough faith in newspaper reports to use them as solid evidence.
But, FWIW, from the reports so far, you're losing badly.

moo
After Ash Wednesday, when many people lost their homes to the fire or their
possessions to theft, the authorities agreed that evacuation would become
optional rather than enforced.
I personally saw homes lost because no-one was there to save them.
I'd be wanting to stay with the house - admittedly with preparations but
that is because I'm financial, educated, mil trained and pilot trained.
Others might want to stay because it's all they have and they know nothing
else.
The fact that they "were told to evacuate" should not be cited as some
overriding measure of blame.
Same with piloting - you make the decision not some bureaucrat or ATC miles
away.
Brian