What engine would you like?

But you
cannot handprop them. And they add complexity and weight. There are
tradeoffs.



Seriously, is there anyting to be gained by making a new engine that is
started by hand propping?

The percentage of the population that cares is almost nil. And their
families have lawyers. Ya Ya Ya, I know, ALL your friends and ALL the best
pilots do it. Great, you have planes you like. But you are small group
within a small group (pilots).

Anyone making a new engine would have to be thinking it will expand the
market place and appeal to NEW pilots. Hand propping is definitely NOT on
the must have list for a new engine to rule the piston market. Sorry if
that means you won't buy one.

What I want is a turbo diesel. I would like around 400hp for short periods
to facilitate short takeoffs. 300hp would be fine after that. The engine
(installed) should not weigh significantly more than current six cylinder
designs. The improved fuel efficiency of a diesel would mean less fuel
weight for even better performance. The lack of magnetos means that only
fuel is needed to run once started. Air cooling would be nice for
simplicity.

Mike
MU-2

"Mike Rapoport" wrote:
What I want is a turbo diesel. ...Air cooling would be nice for
simplicity.

Do you know of successful air cooled turbo diesel applications? Would'nt you
be asking for thermal distribution problems in such an engine, along with the
large mechanical tolerances required to deal with them?
--
Dan
C-172RG at BFM

Mike,

What I want is a turbo diesel. I would like around 400hp for short periods
to facilitate short takeoffs. 300hp would be fine after that. The engine
(installed) should not weigh significantly more than current six cylinder
designs.

Well, the Thielert Centurion 4.0 will be (almost) that engine, depending on
your definition of "not significantly" and your ability to forget about the
400 hp. IMHO, that requirement doesn't really make sense anyway: Why design
something for 400 hp and then run it at only 300?

The lack of magnetos means that only
fuel is needed to run once started.

Not necessarily, with a modern diesel.

Air cooling would be nice for
simplicity.


Depends on your view of "simplicity".


--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Thomas Borchert wrote:

Mike,

What I want is a turbo diesel. I would like around 400hp for short
periods to facilitate short takeoffs. 300hp would be fine after
that. The engine (installed) should not weigh significantly more
than current six cylinder designs.

Well, the Thielert Centurion 4.0 will be (almost) that engine,

FYI, you can see (and hear) it running at
http://www.hp-aircraft.de/img/27-09-04-3.MOV

If you prefer two of them in a taxiing aircaft, try
http://www.hp-aircraft.de/img/TT62%2...%2003dez04.AVI


Greetings,
Markus

"Dan Luke" wrote in message
...
"Mike Rapoport" wrote:
What I want is a turbo diesel. ...Air cooling would be nice for
simplicity.

Do you know of successful air cooled turbo diesel applications? Would'nt
you
be asking for thermal distribution problems in such an engine, along with
the
large mechanical tolerances required to deal with them?
--
Dan
C-172RG at BFM


There are air cooled diesels made by Lombardini for use in tractors and
stationary applications. Diesels tend to run cooler than gasoline engines.
Air cooling should work better with a diesel than with a gasoline engine.

Mike
MU-2

"Thomas Borchert" wrote in message
...
Mike,

What I want is a turbo diesel. I would like around 400hp for short
periods
to facilitate short takeoffs. 300hp would be fine after that. The
engine
(installed) should not weigh significantly more than current six cylinder
designs.

Well, the Thielert Centurion 4.0 will be (almost) that engine, depending
on
your definition of "not significantly" and your ability to forget about
the
400 hp. IMHO, that requirement doesn't really make sense anyway: Why
design
something for 400 hp and then run it at only 300?

The lack of magnetos means that only
fuel is needed to run once started.

Not necessarily, with a modern diesel.

Air cooling would be nice for
simplicity.


Depends on your view of "simplicity".


--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)


Every geared engine that I know of allows higher rpm and hence horsepower
for takeoff and then requires a rpm reduction. I think that radials are
rated for take-off and then have a METO (maximium except take off) rating
which is less. Come to think of it every normally aspirated engine has more
power for take-off than for cruise because of air density.. Seaplanes also
need a lot of power for adequate takeoff performance but not thereafter. I
flew a Murphy Moose with a 360hp engine. We used full power for takeoff but
once at cruise we were back to 50% power. The Moose would do 145mph on
under 14gph but only 155 on 23gph so it only needed the big engine for
takeoff.

Mike
MU-2

Dan Luke wrote:
: "Mike Rapoport" wrote:
: What I want is a turbo diesel. ...Air cooling would be nice for
: simplicity.

: Do you know of successful air cooled turbo diesel applications? Would'nt you
: be asking for thermal distribution problems in such an engine, along with the
: large mechanical tolerances required to deal with them?

Deutz makes large aircooled turbo diesels for the marine industry. 1500HP
and up. They don't have the greatest reputation because of lack of
appreciation of the necessity of keeping the air moving over them, and
the lack of skilled maintenance folks to keep them running. They're
available, though.
--
Aaron C.

Dan Luke wrote:

"Mike Rapoport" wrote:

What I want is a turbo diesel. ...Air cooling would be nice for
simplicity.


Do you know of successful air cooled turbo diesel applications? Would'nt you
be asking for thermal distribution problems in such an engine, along with the
large mechanical tolerances required to deal with them?

I don't know of any in aircraft, but I believe at least one Ag company
had an air cooled diesel (I want to say Deutz, but am not 100% sure).
The biggest problem is making a diesel that is both robust and the same
weight as an equivalent power gasoline engine. The high compression
required for auto ignition comes at a significant penalty in either
weight or reliability ... and most of us want our airplane engines to be
reliable so you pay in weight.


Matt