Dumb Reg question

I've only ever flown Cessna products and I've come across an area I'm not
sure about. I have my private and I have flow 150/2 and 172's since I
starting my training. Now I might partner up with a guy in a Tomahawk next
weekend for a tour across the state. I don't have any formal training in any
Piper products, will I be allowed to log any stick time? I don't recall
exactly how the regs layout type certification. Do I have to be signed off
and have logged instruction to be PIC in the Tomahawk? Also if I only had
time in a 150, would I have to have instruction in a 152 before I could log
PIC?

One last question, If I fly simulated instrument with a safety pilot, does
the safety pilot have to sign my logbook? Thanks to everyone for your help
and response.



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No Dumb Questions.. just hard to interpret Regs..

You are qualified for Airplane Single Engine Land... a Tomahawk is an
Airplane Single Engine Land..
any time you have hands on stick.. that is PIC.. as far as the FAA is
concerned.. you don't need a specific sign off..

the insurance companies or rental FBO may have other ideas... specific make
and model sign offs are insurance company requirements..

If you are under the hood and have a rated pilot acting as a safety pilot,
then all you need is his name..
any time you are flying with hands on stick, with or without the hood, you
are PIC, any time you are under the hood, he may log PIC (acting pic) even
though he may never touch the stick.

BT

"Slick" wrote in message ...
I've only ever flown Cessna products and I've come across an area I'm not
sure about. I have my private and I have flow 150/2 and 172's since I
starting my training. Now I might partner up with a guy in a Tomahawk next
weekend for a tour across the state. I don't have any formal training in
any
Piper products, will I be allowed to log any stick time? I don't recall
exactly how the regs layout type certification. Do I have to be signed off
and have logged instruction to be PIC in the Tomahawk? Also if I only had
time in a 150, would I have to have instruction in a 152 before I could
log
PIC?

One last question, If I fly simulated instrument with a safety pilot, does
the safety pilot have to sign my logbook? Thanks to everyone for your help
and response.



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Thank you very much.
"BTIZ" wrote in message
news:Z4Oce.113$fI.16@fed1read05...
No Dumb Questions.. just hard to interpret Regs..

You are qualified for Airplane Single Engine Land... a Tomahawk is an
Airplane Single Engine Land..
any time you have hands on stick.. that is PIC.. as far as the FAA is
concerned.. you don't need a specific sign off..

the insurance companies or rental FBO may have other ideas... specific
make
and model sign offs are insurance company requirements..

If you are under the hood and have a rated pilot acting as a safety pilot,
then all you need is his name..
any time you are flying with hands on stick, with or without the hood, you
are PIC, any time you are under the hood, he may log PIC (acting pic) even
though he may never touch the stick.

BT

"Slick" wrote in message
...
I've only ever flown Cessna products and I've come across an area I'm
not
sure about. I have my private and I have flow 150/2 and 172's since I
starting my training. Now I might partner up with a guy in a Tomahawk
next
weekend for a tour across the state. I don't have any formal training in
any
Piper products, will I be allowed to log any stick time? I don't recall
exactly how the regs layout type certification. Do I have to be signed
off
and have logged instruction to be PIC in the Tomahawk? Also if I only
had
time in a 150, would I have to have instruction in a 152 before I could
log
PIC?

One last question, If I fly simulated instrument with a safety pilot,
does
the safety pilot have to sign my logbook? Thanks to everyone for your
help
and response.



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News==----
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Newsgroups
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I count six errors in this answer. Can anybody count more?

Jim


"BTIZ" wrote in message
news:Z4Oce.113$fI.16@fed1read05...
No Dumb Questions.. just hard to interpret Regs..

You are qualified for Airplane Single Engine Land... a Tomahawk is an
Airplane Single Engine Land..
any time you have hands on stick.. that is PIC.. as far as the FAA is
concerned.. you don't need a specific sign off..

the insurance companies or rental FBO may have other ideas... specific
make and model sign offs are insurance company requirements..

If you are under the hood and have a rated pilot acting as a safety pilot,
then all you need is his name..
any time you are flying with hands on stick, with or without the hood, you
are PIC, any time you are under the hood, he may log PIC (acting pic) even
though he may never touch the stick.

BT

"RST Engineering" wrote in message
...
I count six errors in this answer. Can anybody count more?

What? Too chicken to actually post what you think are the errors, in fear
someone might reply to your post, writing "I count seven errors in this
answer. Can anybody count more?"

Chicken. If you think he got something wrong, say what you think it is.
You're acting like a politician already.

any time you are flying with hands on stick, with or without the hood, you
are PIC, any time you are under the hood, he may log PIC (acting pic) even
though he may never touch the stick.

Not quite.

You -are- PIC when you are the final authority on the conduct of the
flight (and are so qualified). You -may- -log- PIC if you are
appropriately rated and are sole manipulator (your hands unaided on the
stick).

Yes, two people can -log- PIC, but only one can -be- PIC.

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

ok.. so I left the word "log" out

"Jose" wrote in message
m...
any time you are flying with hands on stick, with or without the hood,
you are PIC, any time you are under the hood, he may log PIC (acting pic)
even though he may never touch the stick.

Not quite.

You -are- PIC when you are the final authority on the conduct of the
flight (and are so qualified). You -may- -log- PIC if you are
appropriately rated and are sole manipulator (your hands unaided on the
stick).

Yes, two people can -log- PIC, but only one can -be- PIC.

Jose
--
Get high on gasoline: fly an airplane.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

You left out and inserted a potful more that was absolutel garbage.

Jim




"BTIZ" wrote in message
news:wZTce.164$fI.40@fed1read05...
ok.. so I left the word "log" out

That doesn't happen to be true. Care to quote your FAR reference for two
people logging PIC at the same time?

Jim





You -are- PIC when you are the final authority on the conduct of the
flight (and are so qualified). You -may- -log- PIC if you are
appropriately rated and are sole manipulator (your hands unaided on the
stick).

Yes, two people can -log- PIC, but only one can -be- PIC.

RST Engineering wrote:
That doesn't happen to be true. Care to quote your FAR reference for
two
people logging PIC at the same time?

There's an article on the AOPA web site (accessible to members only, I
believe) that covers this topic:

http://www.aopa.org/members/files/topics/pic.html

FAR 61.51(e) describes who can log PIC time. In the case of a
simulated instrument flight, both the pilot under-the-hood (sole
manipulator of the controls) and the safety pilot (required crewmember
on a flight requiring more than one pilot, such as a simulated
instrument flight) can log PIC at the same time.

Charles.
-N8385U