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#21
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World Championship gliders
On Thursday, August 7, 2014 11:42:35 AM UTC-4, wrote:
I think we could address a number of concerns by moving to a one design competition format utilizing the Schweizer 2-33A sailplane. Each competitor would be towed aloft and once everyone was airborne, the contest would begin. Competitors would be scored based on Altitude Gained after the start, Time Aloft after the start and then the Accuracy of their Spot Landings upon return. All of the competitors would need to remain within sight of the Glider Field so that spectators would be able to watch and enjoy the competition. This would provide a level playing field, a format which involves the spectators which will help promote the sport, eliminate far away land-outs and retrieves, provide aspiring soaring students an attainable type of competition that they could soon participate in. I think, in some ways, it may provide a true test as to who the BEST glider pilot really is. It's called the Snowbird and it happens every Thanksgiving in Elmira. Been going on for more than 60 years. Make a joke out of it but folks do have fun. UH |
#22
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World Championship gliders
On Thursday, August 7, 2014 12:37:38 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Thursday, August 7, 2014 11:42:35 AM UTC-4, wrote: I think we could address a number of concerns by moving to a one design competition format utilizing the Schweizer 2-33A sailplane. Each competitor would be towed aloft and once everyone was airborne, the contest would begin. Competitors would be scored based on Altitude Gained after the start, Time Aloft after the start and then the Accuracy of their Spot Landings upon return. All of the competitors would need to remain within sight of the Glider Field so that spectators would be able to watch and enjoy the competition. This would provide a level playing field, a format which involves the spectators which will help promote the sport, eliminate far away land-outs and retrieves, provide aspiring soaring students an attainable type of competition that they could soon participate in. I think, in some ways, it may provide a true test as to who the BEST glider pilot really is. It's called the Snowbird and it happens every Thanksgiving in Elmira. Been going on for more than 60 years. Make a joke out of it but folks do have fun. UH Who said I was joking? |
#23
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World Championship gliders
If, instead of calling for more rules, more complex rules, "one-design" designs, "cheaper" competitive planes, we'd simply focus our attention and energy to designing and building a competitive glider, we'd have a much better outcome.
I call for the Shift 18M design. The more I look into it, the more feasible it looks... |
#24
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World Championship gliders
At 00:45 07 August 2014, Sean Fidler wrote:
True but your one design glider would be competitive for many years. Currently your looking at 5-10 years before it becomes obsolete. Discus 2a/LS8 - getting on for 20 year old designs now - well the 8 is even older considering its essentialy an unflapped 6. |
#25
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World Championship gliders
At 00:45 07 August 2014, Sean Fidler wrote:
True but your one design glider would be competitive for many years. Currently your looking at 5-10 years before it becomes obsolete. Discus 2a/LS8 - getting on for 20 year old designs now - well the 8 is even older considering its essentialy an unflapped 6. |
#26
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World Championship gliders
But now that I think about it that does make sense. Shocking. Clearly the narrower fuselage and longer wings results in a dual performance advantage. Less drag/higher aspect ratio.
Many moons ago, SH built a 'Baby-Cirrus' and I think this longer wing/higher aspect ratio thing was part of the experiment. For some reason or another, I can't find a picture of it on the web but it was a Std.-Cirrus with the wings elevated on a pylon very much like the Grunau Baby was configured. It got converted back to a normal Std.-Cirrus after the experiment was done. Uli GM |
#27
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World Championship gliders
On Wednesday, August 6, 2014 3:17:24 PM UTC-4, Sean Fidler wrote:
Interesting though Tom. Good point that you were the dealer though :-). I did not know the wings in the "a" models were allowed to be longer. But now that I think about it that does make sense. Shocking. Wait a minute something Sean didn't know? I'm sure I will wake up from my dream shortly to find out this was a figment of my imagination. Oh wait Sean is bullying Noel Wade is another thread. I guess I am awake because he does plenty of bullying... |
#28
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World Championship gliders
Sean said: 'new glider sales are slowing'.
Is that true? Schleicher and S-H seem to be operating at capacity (I was quoted 3 years delivery on an Arcus, so bought a pre-owned one) and they are bringing out new models thick and fast. And as mentioned in the Shark thread, there is an unusually wide range of choice of high performance rivals from other manufacturers - Lak, Shark, JS1, Binder, Antares, and DG come to mind. Most of them seem to have full order books. Then there are the new generation of lighter gliders such as Silent, Pipistrel and Phoenix. These gliders are not only being bought because the buyers all expect to win world championships with them. If you want to fly a lower performance cheaper class, what is wrong with the Club class? |
#29
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World Championship gliders
Club class is very good, but it is based on handicap racing and (mainly) very old glider designs. The handicap range is fairly wide. Also, certain gliders become more competitive/less competitive based on the conditions. I know of several pilots that had "weak weather gliders" and "strong weather gliders." I find this annoying.
I agree there is little chance of a one design glider class coming to fruition. The current manufacturer driven climate in the sport is fairly locked in for now. They are good people and design and build great products. But I stand behind the idea that a one design concept could improve their business model and the enjoyment of racing pilots in the future. I believe a one design class could strengthen the sport of soaring. Perhaps organizing a one design class from an existing glider which has been built in large numbers (ASW-20 for example) could be successful. The only problem is that Schleicher is not going to build new ASW20's. I would have more fun flying against 30 almost identical gliders then flying in a handicap class (or maybe even the "rule" class of 15 or 18 meter). Imagine the ASW20 Nationals. Or the ASW20 Worlds? For your SH folks, the D2 Nationals or Worlds. Oh well, one can dream. Its pretty clear that few here are receptive to the idea of a mid-high performance one design glider at this time. At least I have plenty of One Design sailing to enjoy. Sean |
#30
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World Championship gliders
Single design class - LS4 would be best choice. Most produced composite
single seat glider -over 1000. Simple to fly - large cockpit - many European clubs use as first solo machine. Solid 40:1 performance. Cost just a little bit more than a new PW5. When PW5 came out - many said the LS4 would have made a much better choice - yet IGC continued with their misguided aproach, much as they have done with 13.5 m class. |
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