On Jan 10, 7:15*am, Steve Leonard wrote:
At 08:51 10 January 2009, wrote:

Technically, I think you are referring the 2007 Regional Rules. In
2008 the first leg was scored from the point you actually leave the start
cylinder. However, for 2007 you are correct. The issue is conceptually
similar to the 2009 proposal, but under the 2007 rules the potential
magnitude of un-scored distance attributable to variations in first turn
fixes was an order of magnitude smaller than would be the worst case under
the proposed rule for 2009.

One thought for a rule modification would be to extend the 115 mph speed
limit inside the start cylinder to extend to the airspace above the start
cylinder. Do loggers track IAS?

9B



No, I was talking relative to the 2008 Nationals Rules. *And I don't
think there is a factor of ten more potential lost distance if you make
the same assumptions of poor start location relative to first turn fix.
The sites that will potentially show this are the ones with low visibility
where you can't see too far out onto the first leg. *This might cause you
to do a serious shift in what part of the first turn area you are aiming
for. *And the longer the required first leg, the smaller the "lost
distance start area" becomes, and the less distance you can potentially
lose by being in the "bad area".

I think the loggers will only report ground speed. *I wouldn't be in
favor of reporting IAS, as some planes have large indicated errors, and
other have very small errors.

And, I didn't see R or N on this, so it applies to all contests for 2009,
right?

Steve Leonard
ZS

Nearly every time I leave out a detail in the name of brevity I get
caught. You are right Steve - the National rules were unchanged w.r.t
Start Anywhere in 2008. We've mostly been discussing the Regional
rules here because there is a helpful distinction between 2007, 2008
and the new proposal.

To answer Andy's question on the distance calculation - I believe the
2008 Regional rules contained a typo an were actually scored without
subtracting the start radius (which i think would have been a weird
random act of math if implemented as written). I could be wrong on
that - I thought I heard it somewhere.

I over-stated the difference in unscored distance penalty between the
2007 Regional and 2009 proposed Regional rules. Theoretically under
either rule you could execute a start, then fly for up to 5 miles
without gettin credit for the distance. My thought was that since
most pilots in practice tended to start near the point where the
courseline hit the cylinder the most you could be off by is 1.6 miles
in the worst case and 0.7 miles for a more "typical" first leg
configuration. That's a bit of apples and oranges, I know. I was
trying to take into account my perception of difference in pilot
behavior under the two rules, where under the old rule starters tended
to congregate at the best thermal near the courseline intersection
with the start cylinder.

9B