On Tue, 16 Mar 2004 23:44:33 -0500, "Kevin Brooks"
wrote:
"Pat Carpenter" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 16 Mar 2004 20:15:03 -0500, "Kevin Brooks"
wrote:
"Pat Carpenter" wrote in message
.. .
On Tue, 16 Mar 2004 12:49:55 -0500, "Kevin Brooks"
wrote:
"Pat Carpenter" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 15 Mar 2004 01:11:01 -0500, "Kevin Brooks"
wrote:
"Pat Carpenter" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 20:26:27 -0800, Henry J Cobb
wrote:
John R Weiss wrote:
If anything, remote-controlled CAS platforms will increase
blue-on-blue, and
they will likely be MORE vulnerable to defenses.
So when will we see a program to train A-10 pilots about the
shapes
of
armored vehicles operated by the United States military?
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/10/02/spr...friendly.fire/
-HJC
Please include UK Warrior vehicles in that training.
Before you get too smug, recall who clanged that Challenger around
Basra
during the latest visit to the area...twasn't the Yanks, and
twasn't
the
Iraqis.
Brooks
Pat Carpenter
Agreed we did but the A-10's mangaged it in both GFI and GFII.
Well, heck, when it is your side that is providing the bulk of the
toys
and
the men to operate them, you can expect that the greater percentage of
untoward incidents will also be in their pocket. Now, can you
enlighten
us
So on that logic then you are saying that you were providing the
majority of the allied targets. So why weren't the Brit's, Canadians
etc. killing large numbers of American participants?
as to just how a RN *AEW* helo (of all things--one would imagine that
such
aircraft are generally better informed about their surrounding traffic
conditions than most) managed to collide with *another* AEW helo (and
in
the
process killed a USN officer on exchange duty)?
As I said earlier, in war "**** happens". Even in the UK forces...
Brooks
Pat Carpenter
Probably the same way as the Patriot shot down two allied aircraft
before a brave F16 pilot smoked the *******. Trouble is too many
systems are treated like toys and not lethal weapons.
What no excuse for the Patriot then?
Excuses? We don' need no stinkin' 'scuses... Like I said, **** happens.
Sorry but **** doesn't just happen, it is normally caused by a string
of events ( try going on an accident investigation course). One should
never just accept it but try to stop it ever happening again.
From
http://www.newscientist.com/hottopic...93575&sub=Secu
rity%20and%20Defence :
""History shows that fratricide is an unavoidable feature of warfare,"
admits the National Audit Office, Britain's public spending watchdog, in
a
2002 report on the MoD's attempts to improve combat identification."
Treated like "toys" huh? From that statement one can assume you have
little
first-hand experience with a profession at arms.
I have been on the close recieving end of some of your modern "toys"
twice in the last decade and a half, have you?
You called them toys, and when you start calling them toys you start
treating them like toys.
Not really. You are rather clueless regarding modern weapons, eh?
I've targeted them, fired them and nearly been killed by them, hence I
think the reverse may be more the case.
As to the RN choppers, they both had their radomes stowed and were
relying on shipboard radar control.
Gee, and not a single Yank around to take responsibility for the act
(unless
you were planning on blaming the one who was killed...?
I don't remember blaming any Americans in that case, correct me if I'm
wrong.
Actually, from the beginning you have taken a rather singleminded approach
to pointing out the US related incidents. When it was merely pointed out to
you that fratricide events have been common to both our respective forces,
you wanted to start tossing out more allegations of US responsibility. Hate
to tell you this, but fratricide is a factor of war; we try to control it as
best we can, but it *will* continue to rear its ugly little head...even
within HM forces.
Please re-read the start of my contribution and you will see than I
just added to an American's request that A-10's recieve better ID
training.
To quote from a WWII saying :-
"When the Luftwaffe bombed the Allies ducked, when the RAF bombed the
Germans ducked but when the Americans bombed every f**ker ducked"
Regarding Operation Tractable (Falaise Gap):
"Bomber Command carried out this operation without American involvement,
but
a large number of bombers, many ironically from 6 Group of the Royal
Canadian Air Force, bombed short."
"The American air force bombed the 3rd Canadian Infantry Division as
they were in a staging area ready to attack the enemy"
We sure did, a bit earlier; we also hammered our own 30th Inf Division not
once, but twice during the COBRA effort. Malmedy got bombed not once but
twice by both B-24's and B-26's. And as we see from the above, so did you.
See what I mean about "**** happens" being applicable to everyone, not just
we 'mercans?
Brooks
"
Those short bombs caused casualties. Like I said, **** happens, even when
you Brits are the ones doing the dealing. George Washington noted a
Brit-on-Brit fratricide incident that occured during the French and
Indian
War, when the detachment he was commanding came within sight of another
British element and both sides opened fire on each other. Maybe you think
Washington bears the sole burden for that event, too?
I think that maybe that you are still living in those far off days.
"**** happens" won't cut it any more in this day and age, if you
really believe that then please stay away from any thing more lethal
than a pocket knife.
Brooks
Pat Carpenter
Pat Carpenter
Pat Carpenter