Brand new winches "can" be expensive? Can be? Wow! There is a plug.

I hear they are well over 100k. Or more! I have heard $250k plus for an advanced european system. "Can" be expensive? I also hear insurance is not cheap either. You say its included? Sure, for the glider. What about the club or operator? When is the last US purchase of a new winch system? What was the price? How many have been purchased in the last 10 years? What are clubs paying to maintain new and old winch systems? What are clubs paying to convert them from wire to spectra? I know of one club that is letting their winch rust rather than pay to upgrade.

I have nothing against winches. I think they are fine. But a car and a rope (auto-towing) is the cheapest, easiest to train method of launching a glider, period. Winches are more expensive and far more complex. These are simple facts.

I don't care, but this thread has been entirely hijacked by a bunch of winch people. For what purpose? Why the hyping of winches? Are you kids afraid of being displaced by auto towing? Why? Are you getting a "spiff" from the winch manufacturer perhaps?

My argument is that if I was a 20 year old and had the right situation (airport size, etc), I would rather have my buddy tow me up with his jeep for free than pay $40 for a tow. Now, why not expand this independence to everyone whenever possible. Another benefit of auto-towing is not having to wait in line or deal with a political soaring club environment. Perhaps interesting to some.

Anyway, as usual, I couldn't care less about this thread anymore. The forest is once again lost for the trees.