Rear engine in a crash question

On Tue, 18 Nov 2003 19:59:31 -0600, Big John
wrote:

Dan

Don't know if you ever saw the N-9 (P-40) and K-14 computing
gunsights (P-51). Both would leave a 'mark' on your forhead in a crash
(that you survived)

Used to be a 'mark of honor'. Then they started making everyone wear
helments.

Big John

The early F4F Wildcats were not equipped with shoulder straps. In
fact few of the early fighters were. In the case of the Wildcat, not
having shoulder straps resulted in a gashed forehead in the event of a
ditching, as the pilot pitched forward and collided with the gunsight.

During the Battle of Midway, in which a lot of Wildcats ditched, one
pilot related that he manage to hurl himself sideways at the moment of
impact with the ocean during a ditching, and avoided being slashed.
In all the text written about this battle, this one pilot was the only
instance recorded of a guy who remembered what would happen during a
ditching, planned how to avoid being injured, and accomplished it.

Another pilot decided to have his crew chief install shoulder straps
to hold him away from the instrument panel coming, and the dreaded
gunsight, in the event of a ditching.

Ironically, the A6M Mitsubishi type 0 fighter WAS equipped with
shoulder straps, but the pilots often wriggled out of them while in
flight so as to allow more freedom of movement to look around.

Corky Scott

On Tue, 18 Nov 2003, BernadetteTS wrote:


I guess this is an opinion thread but what happens to a rear engine
mounted directly behind the pilot in a crash?

I can offer one data point. I flopped down hard enough to brake the
nose landing gear linkage, during my worst landing. We stopped very
fast on the runway.

No prop or engine damage, as they are in the back.

I replaced a rod end, and we flew home with a nasty scrape under
the nose.

A similar landing incident killed two neighbors when their front
engined bird collapsed the nose gear on landing, which lead to
a fire from which they did not escape.

I like mine in the back.

George Graham
RX-7 Powered Graham-EZ, N4449E
Homepage http://bfn.org/~ca266

BernadetteTS wrote:

I've been reading through the BD-5 thread and have a question.

I guess this is an opinion thread but what happens to a rear engine
mounted directly behind the pilot in a crash? In something like an
ultralight, BD-5, Cutiss pusher or Vari-EZ does an engine have a
tendency to rip loose and go through the pilot due to inertia in a
sudden stop? Or in many crashes is the direction of flight not straight
ahead, like if the aircraft was in a stall when it contacted the ground?
The force is down not forward through the cockpit.

Bernadette

The force is forward.

Pusher aircraft may incur a weight penalty because the airframe
requires more structure to ensure the cockpit is not collapsed
by the engine. A clever design, would use other parts of the
airframe already in place. As anothe poster has mentioned
some of the ultralights do not have enough strength to restrain
the engine in a bad crash.

--dan

My father (http://users.erols.com/viewptmd/Dad.html) flew the P-39. He
hated it. The most uncomfortable plane he ever sat in, except for his
Mooney M-18 which had the same problem - no headroom. Having the engine
behind with a shaft running between your legs meant you sat so high there
was no headroom (he was well over 6').

More on topic, he claimed that you had no chance in a forced landing. The
Allison would end up where you were sitting every time, so he said.
Fortunately, never had to test the theory.

--
Bob (Chief Pilot, White Knuckle Airways)


"BernadetteTS" wrote in message
...
I've been reading through the BD-5 thread and have a question.

I guess this is an opinion thread but what happens to a rear engine
mounted directly behind the pilot in a crash? In something like an
ultralight, BD-5, Cutiss pusher or Vari-EZ does an engine have a
tendency to rip loose and go through the pilot due to inertia in a
sudden stop? Or in many crashes is the direction of flight not straight
ahead, like if the aircraft was in a stall when it contacted the ground?
The force is down not forward through the cockpit.

Bernadette