If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below. |
|
|
Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#21
|
|||
|
|||
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message nk.net... "John Clonts" wrote in message news Not the way I read it: "Can Clearance Delivery (through an RCO on the ground) give a pop-up IFR instead of Approach? So far I have found that they ask me to call Approach when airborne, or file with FSS." How can you read "...ask me to call Approach when airborne..." to mean on the ground? As Andrew clarified elsewhere, what he meant might have been more clear if he had written: .... So far I have found that they request "call approach once airborne"... Cheers, John Clonts Temple, Texas N7NZ |
#22
|
|||
|
|||
"Newps" wrote in message news:ODp7c.55613$_w.884010@attbi_s53... John Clonts wrote: When you call ATC to get a clearance... ...if you're in the air and you've filed through FSS, when you call ATC, its not a pop-up. You're picking nits. Some would call that a pop up some wouldn't. ...if you're not in the air and not already filed through FSS, it's not considered a "pop-up"? Is there a different name you call it? Yeah, a pain in the ass. |
#23
|
|||
|
|||
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message ink.net... "John Clonts" wrote in message ... Ok, I'd like to learn something from this... When you call ATC to get a clearance... ...if you're in the air and you've filed through FSS, when you call ATC, its not a pop-up. ...if you're in the air but not already filed through FSS, it's considered a "pop-up" ...if you're not in the air and not already filed through FSS, it's not considered a "pop-up"? Is there a different name you call it? I see that "pop-up" is not in the PC/G. I assume that it's also not defined in 7110. That being the case we're talking about an informal term anyway. I'm just curious (and surprised) that a call from the ramp to CD for an IFR clearance (not already on file) is NOT considered by controllers a "pop-up". "Pop-up" is not defined anywhere. It's my observation, from context, that most pilots consider a pop-up to be any airborne pickup of an IFR clearance. I share that opinion. Good enough! |
#24
|
|||
|
|||
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message nk.net... "John Clonts" wrote in message news Not the way I read it: "Can Clearance Delivery (through an RCO on the ground) give a pop-up IFR instead of Approach? So far I have found that they ask me to call Approach when airborne, or file with FSS." How can you read "...ask me to call Approach when airborne..." to mean on the ground? He's on the ground. CD says to him: "...contact approach when airborne..." |
#25
|
|||
|
|||
"John Clonts" wrote in message ... He's on the ground. CD says to him: "...contact approach when airborne..." Interesting. A clearance delivery position that won't deliver a clearance to an aircraft on the ground. |
#26
|
|||
|
|||
It may not be a clearance delivery position. Here at FCI, the RCO puts us
in contact with a Potomac Tracon controller, not the class C Richmond CD controller located 11 miles away. Its the same guy who answers our calls on the departure frequency is the same guy answering the RCO for getting clearances. Of course it could be an incredible coincidence, with the CD controller rotating from his CD position at the Richmond tower to the Tracon, 75 miles away, during my run-up. Brad Z. "Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message ink.net... "John Clonts" wrote in message ... He's on the ground. CD says to him: "...contact approach when airborne..." Interesting. A clearance delivery position that won't deliver a clearance to an aircraft on the ground. |
#27
|
|||
|
|||
"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message ink.net... "John Clonts" wrote in message ... He's on the ground. CD says to him: "...contact approach when airborne..." Interesting. A clearance delivery position that won't deliver a clearance to an aircraft on the ground. Indeed. To Andrew it was interesting enough to prompt him to post a usenet question about it! |
#28
|
|||
|
|||
The frequency I called was the definitely the clearance delivery
frequency for the uncontrolled field, not the approach control frequency. However, now that you mention it, it seems quite possible that the approach controller could have been the guy handling the CD RCO frequency. However, that does not explain the strangeness of this situation. Had he asked me to call FSS and left it at that, I would not have considered that strange. But he asked me to call FSS OR call approach once airborne, which implied that in order to give a clearance on the ground I would have to file with FSS, but an airborne clearance could be had without filing with FSS. I understand the confusion over the phrase 'pop-up' so I will avoid using that. "Brad Z" wrote in message news:Pdr7c.55839$_w.891264@attbi_s53... It may not be a clearance delivery position. Here at FCI, the RCO puts us in contact with a Potomac Tracon controller, not the class C Richmond CD controller located 11 miles away. Its the same guy who answers our calls on the departure frequency is the same guy answering the RCO for getting clearances. Of course it could be an incredible coincidence, with the CD controller rotating from his CD position at the Richmond tower to the Tracon, 75 miles away, during my run-up. Brad Z. "Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message ink.net... "John Clonts" wrote in message ... He's on the ground. CD says to him: "...contact approach when airborne..." Interesting. A clearance delivery position that won't deliver a clearance to an aircraft on the ground. |
#29
|
|||
|
|||
|
#30
|
|||
|
|||
"Andrew Sarangan" wrote in message om... The frequency I called was the definitely the clearance delivery frequency As is the case at FCI. The controller is working both the approach frequency and the CD RCO. You can hear him transmitting on both frequencies. for the uncontrolled field, not the approach control frequency. However, now that you mention it, it seems quite possible that the approach controller could have been the guy handling the CD RCO frequency. However, that does not explain the strangeness of this situation. Had he asked me to call FSS and left it at that, I would not have considered that strange. But he asked me to call FSS OR call approach once airborne, which implied that in order to give a clearance on the ground I would have to file with FSS, but an airborne clearance could be had without filing with FSS. Could be a workload issue, or perhaps it's his *principle*. In his mind, you're on the ground so there is no good reason you'd need to tie up his radio time, off his approach control frequency, to get you in the system while you're safe on the ground. Some controllers are more hard-ass about this than others. I understand the confusion over the phrase 'pop-up' so I will avoid using that. "Brad Z" wrote in message news:Pdr7c.55839$_w.891264@attbi_s53... It may not be a clearance delivery position. Here at FCI, the RCO puts us in contact with a Potomac Tracon controller, not the class C Richmond CD controller located 11 miles away. Its the same guy who answers our calls on the departure frequency is the same guy answering the RCO for getting clearances. Of course it could be an incredible coincidence, with the CD controller rotating from his CD position at the Richmond tower to the Tracon, 75 miles away, during my run-up. Brad Z. "Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message ink.net... "John Clonts" wrote in message ... He's on the ground. CD says to him: "...contact approach when airborne..." Interesting. A clearance delivery position that won't deliver a clearance to an aircraft on the ground. |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Thread Starter | Forum | Replies | Last Post |
No SID in clearance, fly it anyway? | Roy Smith | Instrument Flight Rules | 195 | November 28th 05 10:06 PM |
Clearance: Direct to airport with /U | Judah | Instrument Flight Rules | 8 | February 27th 04 06:02 PM |
AFSS clearance delivery | Dan Luke | Instrument Flight Rules | 7 | February 9th 04 12:56 AM |
Q about lost comms on weird clearance | Paul Tomblin | Instrument Flight Rules | 34 | February 2nd 04 09:11 PM |
Picking up a Clearance Airborne | Brad Z | Instrument Flight Rules | 30 | August 29th 03 01:31 AM |