Temporarily removing fuel and replacing it into the same aircraft

wrote in message
...

My friendly-neighborhood AIRPORT manager tried to mandate no self-fueling
of aircraft shortly after we shelled out just
shy of $2000 for an autogas STC for our PA-28-180. I pointed him in the
direction of the regulations regarding restrictions on
public airports that accept federal funding. Included in those (can't
find the link at the moment) is a requirement that pilots
can fuel their own aircraft for non-commercial use. Non-issue after that.

-Cory

The FAA doc is AC 150/5190-6
http://tinyurl.com/yo2ezv
John Severyn
KLVK Livermore, Ca.

"pgbnh" wrote:
"Al G" wrote...
"B A R R Y" wrote...

2.) I want to calibrate a fuel dipstick, so I remove a gallon at a
time while taking readings. After I read the tank, I return the
fuel to the tank.

I've been told this is a violation. The person who tells me this
can't cite a FAR, and I can't find one in my own search.

I hope it is not a violation, I've had to do this at remote
mountain
airstrips
for years. I have seen tanks calibrated(Sticks & Gauges) in an
approved shop.

Greater likelihood is that you may be violating an AIRPORT rule. If
your field does not permit self-fueling, then the activity you note
would probably be considered a violation. But FAR's???? Naahh !

Fly it to a remote strip and do as you wish, but follow the antistatic
procedures others have mentioned...

On Tue, 31 Jul 2007 13:55:49 GMT, Darrel Toepfer
wrote:

"pgbnh" wrote:
"Al G" wrote...
"B A R R Y" wrote...

2.) I want to calibrate a fuel dipstick, so I remove a gallon at a
time while taking readings. After I read the tank, I return the
fuel to the tank.

I've been told this is a violation. The person who tells me this
can't cite a FAR, and I can't find one in my own search.

I hope it is not a violation, I've had to do this at remote
mountain
airstrips
for years. I have seen tanks calibrated(Sticks & Gauges) in an
approved shop.

Greater likelihood is that you may be violating an AIRPORT rule. If
your field does not permit self-fueling, then the activity you note
would probably be considered a violation. But FAR's???? Naahh !

Check those airport rules, but when I had the Deb weighed for a new
W&B (old airplanes like old pilots tend to gain weight) they drained
the tanks. (it was down to about 60 gallons) and then put it back
along with enough to top off *all* tanks.

If it's a violation that was a mighty big company doing the violating.

Fly it to a remote strip and do as you wish, but follow the antistatic
procedures others have mentioned...

An FAA ops inspector at HQ once gave me a list of all of the regulatory
agencies pilots have to answer to. One of them was the EPA. If there is any
prohibition against doing what you suggest you will find it in EPA regs, not
FARs. The FARs are only the tip of the iceberg.

Bob Gardner

"B A R R Y" wrote in message
. net...
Does anyone know of a FAR that prohibits removing fuel, avgas in this
case, and then putting it back into the same plane? The plane is flown
for part 91 service only.

Examples:

1.) The plane is 50 pounds overweight for conditions. 10 gallons is
siphoned out into a clean, single-purpose, approved for gasoline
container. The sealed container is stored in a safe place. 2-3 hours
later, upon completing the trip and returning to the field, I pour it back
into the tank.

2.) I want to calibrate a fuel dipstick, so I remove a gallon at a time
while taking readings. After I read the tank, I return the fuel to the
tank.

I've been told this is a violation. The person who tells me this can't
cite a FAR, and I can't find one in my own search.

Sorry about the double post...senior moment.

Bob

"Bob Gardner" wrote in message
. ..
An FAA ops inspector at HQ once gave me a list of all of the regulatory
agencies pilots have to answer to. One of them was the EPA. If there is
any prohibition against doing what you suggest you will find it in EPA
regs, not FARs. The FARs are only the tip of the iceberg.

Bob Gardner

"B A R R Y" wrote in message
. net...
Does anyone know of a FAR that prohibits removing fuel, avgas in this
case, and then putting it back into the same plane? The plane is flown
for part 91 service only.

Examples:

1.) The plane is 50 pounds overweight for conditions. 10 gallons is
siphoned out into a clean, single-purpose, approved for gasoline
container. The sealed container is stored in a safe place. 2-3 hours
later, upon completing the trip and returning to the field, I pour it
back into the tank.

2.) I want to calibrate a fuel dipstick, so I remove a gallon at a time
while taking readings. After I read the tank, I return the fuel to the
tank.

I've been told this is a violation. The person who tells me this can't
cite a FAR, and I can't find one in my own search.

Pilots frequently say "I can't find it in the regulations" after limiting
their search to Parts 1, 61, 67, 91, and (occasionally) 119/135. An FAA ops
inspector at HQ once gave me a list of all of the agencies whose regulations
impact pilots. I no longer have the list, but as I recall there were about
20. We know about the NTSB Part 830 accident/incident regs because they are
on the knowledge exams, and we know that there are National Park Service,
Bureau of Land Management, and Interior Department regs affecting both
airspace and landing areas because they show up on sectionals and things
like the Grand Canyon SFAR. What I am leading up to is a guess that the
Environmental Protection Agency may very well have a reg that speaks to the
operation you propose. The airport management and/or the governmental entity
operating the airport might have local regulations on the subject.

Bottom line is that you can't just look to the FARs when contemplating an
action.

Bob Gardner

"B A R R Y" wrote in message
. net...
Does anyone know of a FAR that prohibits removing fuel, avgas in this
case, and then putting it back into the same plane? The plane is flown
for part 91 service only.

Examples:

1.) The plane is 50 pounds overweight for conditions. 10 gallons is
siphoned out into a clean, single-purpose, approved for gasoline
container. The sealed container is stored in a safe place. 2-3 hours
later, upon completing the trip and returning to the field, I pour it back
into the tank.

2.) I want to calibrate a fuel dipstick, so I remove a gallon at a time
while taking readings. After I read the tank, I return the fuel to the
tank.

I've been told this is a violation. The person who tells me this can't
cite a FAR, and I can't find one in my own search.

On Mon, 23 Jul 2007 13:33:28 -0400, B A R R Y
wrote:

Does anyone know of a FAR that prohibits removing fuel, avgas in this
case, and then putting it back into the same plane? The plane is flown
for part 91 service only.

Examples:

1.) The plane is 50 pounds overweight for conditions. 10 gallons is
siphoned out into a clean, single-purpose, approved for gasoline
container. The sealed container is stored in a safe place. 2-3 hours
later, upon completing the trip and returning to the field, I pour it
back into the tank.

2.) I want to calibrate a fuel dipstick, so I remove a gallon at a time
while taking readings. After I read the tank, I return the fuel to the
tank.

I've been told this is a violation. The person who tells me this can't
cite a FAR, and I can't find one in my own search.

barry
you cant do it with people in the aircraft. that is in the regs.

when you do it make sure you have an earth connection between the
aircraft and the container. this can be as simple as a piece of fence
wire in the container touching the aircraft so as to bleed static
differences between the two. more elaborate would be a piece of
automotive wire with a crocodile clip on each end clipped between the
aircraft and the container.
with static taken care of you worst problem is spillage.

when you have the time go and get a copy of the regs and read them
yourself. it isnt difficult to understand them and you will have in
your memory an authoritative picture of them. the world gets easier
after that.

when you put the fuel back into the aircraft just pour it through a
funnel with a micromesh filter in it, they are as cheap as chips in
discount automotive shops and they exclude crud and water.

Stealth Pilot

Thanks for all the GREAT info!

FWIW, I found the best way to de-fuel my plane is through the carb.
Unfortunately, it renders the fuel unusable, but it's alot of fun.


"B A R R Y" wrote in message
news


Thanks for all the GREAT info!

El Maximo wrote:
FWIW, I found the best way to de-fuel my plane is through the carb.
Unfortunately, it renders the fuel unusable, but it's alot of fun.

Me too, but when you're 50 pounds over, and don't have the extra hour...