Punctured pressure cabin.

"Tex Houston" wrote in
:


"M. J. Powell" wrote in message
...

There has been a bit of a furore over here concerning the new US
requirement to airlines to supply air marshals when requested. The
concern is mainly over the possible puncture of a pressure cabin.
What do readers think is the result of decompression via a bullet
hole?

Mike
--
M.J.Powell

Unless it hits electrical or hydraulic systems pretty much nothing.
Score it as a miss. A bullet hole will not decompress an airplane. A
hatch leak will probably leak more and can be easily overcome by the
pressurization system.

Tex




Even then,it's very hard for a bullet to get to the electrical or hydraulic
systems(besides actually hitting them),those being UNDER the passenger
deck.You'd have to shoot at a fairly steep angle,and the bullet would lose
energy pretty quickly.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net

I think it depends on WHO the bullet passes through on its way to the
outside...

Jack

"M. J. Powell" wrote in message
...

There has been a bit of a furore over here concerning the new US
requirement to airlines to supply air marshals when requested. The
concern is mainly over the possible puncture of a pressure cabin.
What do readers think is the result of decompression via a bullet hole?

Mike
--
M.J.Powell

From: "Jack G"
Date: 12/31/2003 8:15 PM Central Standard Time
Message-id:

I think it depends on WHO the bullet passes through on its way to the
outside...

Jack

"M. J. Powell"

Which begs the question are terrorist more, less or equal in density to normal
people?

Another question is if the terrorist is female will she still get the 72
virgins when she is "martyred?"

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

Another question is if the terrorist is female will she still get the 72
virgins when she is "martyred?"

Perhaps she gets multiplied into 72 virgins.
all the best -- Dan Ford
email:

see the Warbird's Forum at www.warbirdforum.com
and the Piper Cub Forum at www.pipercubforum.com

From: Cub Driver
Date: 1/1/2004 5:06 AM Central Standard Time
Message-id:


Another question is if the terrorist is female will she still get the 72
virgins when she is "martyred?"

Perhaps she gets multiplied into 72 virgins.
all the best -- Dan Ford
email:

OK, if she dies a virgin does her obituary say "returned unopened?"

Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired

"B2431" wrote in message
...
| From: Cub Driver
| Date: 1/1/2004 5:06 AM Central Standard Time
| Message-id:
|
|
| Another question is if the terrorist is female will she still get the 72
| virgins when she is "martyred?"
|
| Perhaps she gets multiplied into 72 virgins.
| all the best -- Dan Ford
| email:
|
| OK, if she dies a virgin does her obituary say "returned unopened?"
|
| Dan, U.S. Air Force, retired





Opened in error ?






Cheers


Dave Kearton

[round loose..]

It depends on what it passes through on the way out.

The skin? No big deal
Control cables/wiring/fuel/hydraulics...?
The windscreen? I donno...




--
A host is a host from coast to
& no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX
Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433
is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

From: "M. J. Powell"


There has been a bit of a furore over here concerning the new US
requirement to airlines to supply air marshals when requested. The
concern is mainly over the possible puncture of a pressure cabin.
What do readers think is the result of decompression via a bullet hole?
M.J.Powell

What do you think will decompress an airliner cabin faster: An errant round
fired by an air marshal puncturing the cabin skin, or, the detonation of a
Richard Reid type jihadi nut case's shoe bomb because the air marshal wasn't
armed and couldn't drill him right between his beady eyes at the first
opportunity?

I'll take my chances with the air marshal's gun thanks.
Dave

M. J. Powell wrote:

: There has been a bit of a furore over here concerning the new US
: requirement to airlines to supply air marshals when requested. The
: concern is mainly over the possible puncture of a pressure cabin.
: What do readers think is the result of decompression via a bullet hole?

A bullet hole would not in itself cause for much concern.
The loss of a cabin window would be more serious, not
because the pressurisation system would be unable to cope,
but because the strong air current could move (in the worst
case, blow out through the window) or wound passengers. In
extreme cases, rapid pressure loss (or perhaps
more accurately, an internal pressure differential) can
lead to major structural failures, especially around
bulkheads that are insufficiently vented -- the pressure
differential is enough to make these collapse -- or in
fuselages that are already 'tired'. Apart from the Comet
disasters, I know of no loss of aircraft caused by the
loss of windows (although some passengers have been lost)
but a number of aircraft have been lost when doors failed.

There is also the risk of bullets bouncing around inside
the plane and doing damage to power lines, fuel systems,
etc. Historically, fire has been the major killer of
aircraft following projectile damage.

Seems to me that although loss of cabin pressure is serious
concern (IIRC military aircraft were designed to maintain
lower cabin pressure than airliners, to limit the damage
amplification following a hit) but not the most serious one.
The worst problem is the prospect of a gun battle in a cabin
packed with people. Almost every stray bullet is going to
hit someone; even if the sky marshall hits the right man
(or woman) the bullet seems likely to hit others as well.

This is going to require very fine judgment by the sky
marshall. He or she also has to distinguish between a
conventional hijack best dealt with by negotiation (are
sky marshalls trained to conduct hostage-release
negotiations?) which are the vast majority of cases,
and a rare attempt to use an airliner as a suicide bomb.
This seems to be a job requiring very extensive training,
a very cool head, and fine judgment. I am not convinced
that the large number of sky marshalls rapidly trained
and deployed now have the right capabilities, and I don't
think it is wise at all to give guns to pilots after
minimal training.


--
Emmanuel Gustin

In article ,
"Emmanuel.Gustin" wrote:

This is going to require very fine judgment by the sky
marshall. He or she also has to distinguish between a
conventional hijack best dealt with by negotiation (are
sky marshalls trained to conduct hostage-release
negotiations?) which are the vast majority of cases,
and a rare attempt to use an airliner as a suicide bomb.

No one is ever going to be able to hijack an airliner anywhere in the
world any more and expect people to believe that they're merely going to
hold the passengers and plane hostage.

The stakes have been upped to the max for all future hijack attempts,
and nobody can *afford* to assume "good" motives by anyone who tries to
take over a plane, *ever*.

From here on out, a hijack attempt will, by any rational person, be
treated as an attempt at mass murder. If you want to make a political
statement, hijack a ferry or a bus.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.