Engine failure on final

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 09:54:38 -0500, Corky Scott
wrote:


Can anyone cite an instance when a pilot lost his engine while on
final and landed short because of it?

Here is another one that happened here last year in Colorado Springs.

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?e...18X00899&key=1


Scott D

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I can think of two at my airport in the past 5 years. A C-182 landed
short in the power lines because the engine did not respond when he
added power.. And a Piper Cherokee that ran out of fuel on final and
landed in a feild short of the runway this summer..

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing
you
can do about it. Is that true?
************************************************** ***********************

Worse than that, is that I have noticed that many pilots seem to take
off using power... That guarantees that they absolutely will land short
if they lose power... What should we all do about that?

Denny jeez

Ron Garret wrote:
The discussion about cutting power on final reminded me of something
I've been puzzled about for some time now.

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most
people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing
you
can do about it. Is that true? Or have I missed something? What
should you do if you lose your engine just after turning base to
final?

Raise the gear. You'll glide better.

Ron Garret wrote:
If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most
people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing
you
can do about it. Is that true?

More or less. In some cases you can play tricks with retracting
gear/flaps, but usually it's not worth it.

The important question is this - other than running out of gas, what
would cause you to go from not having any engine problems at all, to
not having enough power to maintain a 3 degree glideslope (surely you
don't fly any flatter than that?) in the time it takes to fly a pattern
at the reduced power setting used in the pattern? Honestly, I can't
think of anything. And of course if you have engine problems or aren't
sure about having enough fuel, you will, I assume, fly a power-off
pattern and commit to land.

Many instructors teach power-off patterns (idle abeam the numbers). I
teach it too, but not as a normal procedure. It's simply not practical
most of the time (due to traffic). Of course if I were teaching in the
average rental (and teaching people who were going to be flying typical
rentals) I might feel differently.

Michael

On 21 Jan 2005 11:46:20 -0800, "Michael"
wrote:

Many instructors teach power-off patterns (idle abeam the numbers). I
teach it too, but not as a normal procedure. It's simply not practical
most of the time (due to traffic).

This of course is the whole point. Power-off landings are the sensible
thing to do, but traffic at some airports makes them unwise. I don't
know if it's "most of the time"; certainly it's very seldom that I
encounter heavy traffic.

I almost always fly power-off from the time I am abreast my landing
spot, and that's fine at the airports I inhabit. I am almost never in
the pattern with another aircraft--and if there is, it's usually
another Cub. If there is a plane on the runway when I am in the
pattern, I reckon it a busy day; if two, a very busy day.



-- all the best, Dan Ford

email (put Cubdriver in subject line)

Warbird's Forum: www.warbirdforum.com
Piper Cub Forum: www.pipercubforum.com
the blog: www.danford.net

Ron Garret wrote:

What
should you do if you lose your engine just after turning base to final?

That's going to depend on the type of landing I was planning to make. With a
normal landing, I won't have power on at that point, so let's assume I'm
dragging it in for a short field landing. Or maybe I just screwed up and I have
power on 'cause I'm a little low. If I've got flaps down, up they come. I will
lower or raise the nose as necessary to hit 83 mph (best glide). I'll reduce
that speed when I flare.

Then I will hit the cheapest and softest thing out there as slowly as I can.

George Patterson
The desire for safety stands against every great and noble enterprise.

Ron Garret wrote:

The discussion about cutting power on final reminded me of something
I've been puzzled about for some time now.

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing you
can do about it. Is that true? Or have I missed something? What
should you do if you lose your engine just after turning base to final?

Is that true? Have you missed something? Yes, lots!

0. Airspeed! Best place to land! (Rmember ABC)
1. Raise flaps
2. Prop low RPM
3. Raise gear
4. Then quickly run through obvious engine stuff - don't forget to pump the
primer

Of course, 1-4 apply if you think you're not going to make a runway.

Hilton

"Hilton" wrote in message ink.net...
Ron Garret wrote:

The discussion about cutting power on final reminded me of something
I've been puzzled about for some time now.

If you fly final with some amount of power (which I gather most people
do -- I always have) that seems to guarantee that if you lose your
engine on final you will land short, and there's pretty much nothing you
can do about it. Is that true? Or have I missed something? What
should you do if you lose your engine just after turning base to final?

Is that true? Have you missed something? Yes, lots!

0. Airspeed! Best place to land! (Rmember ABC)
1. Raise flaps
2. Prop low RPM
3. Raise gear
4. Then quickly run through obvious engine stuff - don't forget to pump the
primer

Of course, 1-4 apply if you think you're not going to make a runway.

Hilton



Also, lower nose if necessary to get best glide speed...

and that will often mean flying a little faster than that since you are
probably gliding upwind to a point on the ground, after discounting the
fact that you are probably far below gross. If you don't have a feel
for that speed, err on the high side if there is a wind.

Blueskies wrote:

Also, lower nose if necessary to get best glide speed...