CAVU and I'm Grounded!

If it is not on the airworthiness certificate list of required equipment,
hang an INOP tag on it, and go fly...
denny
"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:0u43c.504960$I06.5400101@attbi_s01...
But then, around here I would just turn the damned thing off. He
apparently doesn't have that option.

That would make it two FARs you're violating instead of just one.

I can't turn my transponder off and go fly VFR?

Boy, I apparently know an awful lot of people that need to be arrested.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

On Mon, 08 Mar 2004 21:55:16 GMT, "G.R. Patterson III"
wrote:



Jay Honeck wrote:

I can't turn my transponder off and go fly VFR?

That's correct. If you have a transponder that's operable, it must be on at all
times when you're in the air.

Even in D, E, and G? 91.215 only references class A, B, and C airspace
and I was under the impression (instructor and the Cessna Cleared for
Takeoff book) that unless you were within those areas (or within the
veil outside of the B) that transponder use was optional.

Jay Honeck wrote:

I can't turn my transponder off and go fly VFR?

You're right - I misread part 91.

George Patterson
Battle, n; A method of untying with the teeth a political knot that would
not yield to the tongue.

Saryon wrote:

Even in D, E, and G? 91.215 only references class A, B, and C airspace
and I was under the impression (instructor and the Cessna Cleared for
Takeoff book) that unless you were within those areas (or within the
veil outside of the B) that transponder use was optional.

You're right. I misread the FAR.

George Patterson
Battle, n; A method of untying with the teeth a political knot that would
not yield to the tongue.

Even in D, E, and G? 91.215 only references class A, B, and C airspace
and I was under the impression (instructor and the Cessna Cleared for
Takeoff book) that unless you were within those areas (or within the
veil outside of the B) that transponder use was optional.

You're right. I misread the FAR.

Whew! Man, George, I thought I was losing my mind for a minute there.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Saryon" wrote in message ...
On Mon, 08 Mar 2004 21:55:16 GMT, "G.R. Patterson III"
wrote:



Jay Honeck wrote:

I can't turn my transponder off and go fly VFR?

That's correct. If you have a transponder that's operable, it must be on at all
times when you're in the air.

Even in D, E, and G? 91.215 only references class A, B, and C airspace
and I was under the impression (instructor and the Cessna Cleared for
Takeoff book) that unless you were within those areas (or within the
veil outside of the B) that transponder use was optional.

In any controlled airspace. Read 91.215(c). If you got it, squawk it is the
rule.

Carl Orton wrote:
ARRRRGHH!
Just took possession of a '67 172 on Monday. Aside from work obligations and
IFR weather in the DFW area the past week, I was really really really
looking forward to this morning (Sat) to take my first flight alone in the
new bird.
Going over the logs once again last night (about the 4th time...) it
suddenly hits me - there's no record of a 24 month transponder check!!!
Grounded!!! Of all the checks we did on the pre-purchase, that one slipped
by. Shame on me. And it is one heckuva beeeyoutiful day out there. *sigh*
Oh well; that's the joy of aircraft ownership, I guess.....

Unless you have a Mode-S transponder and TCAS, a Mode-C/Mode-A
transponder has little value unless all the aircraft around you are in
radar and radio contact with ATC.
US aerobatic champion John Lillberg, flying his Extra 300S, was run over
from behind by a Lear 35 on a training flight. Both had been squawking
and talking to Class D airspace tower, the accident occurred just
outside the airspace boundaries. That was, what... five years ago?

nope... if you have one it must be on...

BT

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:0u43c.504960$I06.5400101@attbi_s01...
But then, around here I would just turn the damned thing off. He
apparently doesn't have that option.

That would make it two FARs you're violating instead of just one.

I can't turn my transponder off and go fly VFR?

Boy, I apparently know an awful lot of people that need to be arrested.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

George.. please re read it... is not ClassE controlled airspace? so is not a
transponder required.. and all the time above 10000MSL if you have one?

BT

"G.R. Patterson III" wrote in message
...


Saryon wrote:

Even in D, E, and G? 91.215 only references class A, B, and C airspace
and I was under the impression (instructor and the Cessna Cleared for
Takeoff book) that unless you were within those areas (or within the
veil outside of the B) that transponder use was optional.

You're right. I misread the FAR.

George Patterson
Battle, n; A method of untying with the teeth a political knot that
would
not yield to the tongue.

Thanks, Malcolm! As I said in some other parts of this thread (man! how
this thing has grown!), I'm right smack under the DFW Class B. PLUS, it was
my first flight in an airplane of unknown reliability. I just had too many
unknowns to (in my view) risk it. However, the local instrument shop (Stahl
Air Instrument) to do a ramp check and sign the logbook, so it all worked
out.


"Malcolm Teas" wrote in message
om...
"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:dmM2c.79638$ko6.426325@attbi_s02...
You need the transponder check even for VFR. I suspect he's close
enough
to the class B to require it.

If he's in Class B, he's definitely screwed without a transponder.

Or inside an ADIZ. Or he doesn't want to fly w/o flight following.

However, it's not broken -- he's missing a piece of paperwork. If the
thing
is working (and, as I said, ATC will let you know if something is
amiss),
make an appointment to get the thing checked, and go fly.

As others have pointed out, missing paperwork might be no problem at
all. Or, in case of a ramp check or small incident, might turn out to
be a very big problem.

A transponder is hardly a flight-critical instrument.

Depends, we don't really know his situation. He might always like to
fly with FF, he might be inside an Bravo's veil or under an ADIZ. He
might always fly IFR.

It's always easy, and fun, to sit back and offer ideas. Useful too in
many cases, especially for low-timers like myself. But in the end,
he's PIC in this case and is most likely considering things that we're
not aware of.

-Malcolm Teas