Air America breaking news: "USA to fingerprint ALL visitors !!!"

Alan Pollock wrote:

Seriously, driver's licenses are used as ID in the US.

Try to think. Figure it out. Oh wait. Nex



Which states take fingerprints for driver's licenses? I know first-hand
that Illinois and Oregon do not ...

gld

In article ,
AJC wrote:

Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.

Check up on Brazil, then. They were complaining about fingerprinting
people from Brazil coming into the US, but neglected to note that they
already fingerprint and photograph *all* of their own citizens.

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

Chad Irby wrote:

AJC wrote:

Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.

Check up on Brazil, then. They were complaining about fingerprinting
people from Brazil coming into the US, but neglected to note that they
already fingerprint and photograph *all* of their own citizens.

Does that somehow make it better? Note he said a "big brother" regime.

How do you feel about the registration of firearm?

In article ,
James Robinson wrote:

Chad Irby wrote:

AJC wrote:

Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.

Check up on Brazil, then. They were complaining about fingerprinting
people from Brazil coming into the US, but neglected to note that they
already fingerprint and photograph *all* of their own citizens.

Does that somehow make it better? Note he said a "big brother" regime.

Brazil is a democracy, you should look up your terms.

How do you feel about the registration of firearm?

I don't approve of it.

Note that over the last couple of years, firearms laws have been
*relaxing* across most of the US, with one of the sillier ones going
away this September (the Assault Weapons Ban).

--
cirby at cfl.rr.com

Remember: Objects in rearview mirror may be hallucinations.
Slam on brakes accordingly.

James Robinson wrote:
How do you feel about the registration of firearm?

That is in fact quite different. Registration of firearm is no different from
registration of a car or aircraft. Since since all three are dangerous and
kill (with the firearm designed for the sole purpose fo killing and giving no
transportation or other benefit), it is only normal that a government would
want to ensure that you are qualified to operate such a device by requiring registration.

But if a government captures your own body's information (fingerprints, DNA,
eye retina scan etc), then they "own" part of your body/identity.

"Chad Irby" wrote in message
om...
In article ,
AJC wrote:

Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.

Check up on Brazil, then. They were complaining about fingerprinting
people from Brazil coming into the US, but neglected to note that they
already fingerprint and photograph *all* of their own citizens.

What a country does to its own citizens is a matter for that country and
those very citizens. Do you understand that?

What it does to other nationalities can be insulting and insensitive. That
is what the USA is.

"AJC" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 3 Apr 2004 07:55:44 -0600, "Quantum Foam Guy"
wrote:

"Oelewapper" wrote in message
...
Dear allies, welcome to the age of digital fascism... :

This is not "fascism", unless you're one of those morons who thinks
dealing
with the DMV and getting fingerprinted for a driver's license is
"fascism".

Having finger-prints taken for a driving licence? Maybe in Cuba, the
former DDR, or some other 'big brother' regime, but certainly not in
any free country. Finger-printing is for criminals.

Most US states started fingerprinting people applying for drivers licenses
(one electronic thumb print scan) in the early 1990s. This happened during
the Clinton administration. Fancy that.

This is the same system the VISIT program will use. It's not inconvenient,
unless you think spending two seconds pressing your finger to a glass
surface is inconvenient. If you object to it due to your ethics and
principles, I respect your opinion. Enjoy your vacation in Australia or
elsewhere this summer. Just remember that this same process will soon be
used in other countries that are on the Islamicist hit lists. That's why
you're not hearing a big stink from European leaders about the program. They
will be monitoring US-VISIT to see how to best implement similar programs in
the near future. Doubt me? Watch and see what happens.

Personally, I'd be more concerned about my privacy in Europe with so much
closed-circuit television monitoring and the facial recognition technology
they use. Like this:
http://www.spy.org.uk/n-mandrake.htm

For those who fear Big Brother, that's a true sphincter-tingler. I certainly
don't care if EU customs people want to take my fingerprint at the airport
when it confirms my identity and proves to the local government that I'm not
a criminal. In fact, with the threat of terrorism we all face I would prefer
it if they did so. The ability to track my movements around the country once
I've arrived for no legitimate legal reason frightens me.

Quantum Foam Guy wrote:

Oelewapper wrote:

Dear allies, welcome to the age of digital fascism... :

This is not "fascism", unless you're one of those morons who thinks dealing
with the DMV and getting fingerprinted for a driver's license is "fascism".

I do consider it fascism. I also have never had my fingerprints taken
for a driver's license in the US.

When you lace your writing with such stupid hyperbole, you've lost your
credibility.

If you can't see creeping totalitarianism, then you must be part of the
problem.

You're also mistaken if you think this will be limited to the US. Wealthy
democracies will all be implementing these very same procedures. If you
doubt me, wait and see what happens after the next round of terrorist
attacks.

Not so. Just look at Europe with is about to go to court to prevent
airlines from passing passenger information to the US TSA as a violation
of European privacy laws. They seem to take privacy much more seriously
than the US, even though there have been many more terrorist attacks in
their home countries. They don't see the need to give up their rights
like the supposedly "free" USA to tackle terrorism.

On Sat, 03 Apr 2004 14:46:54 GMT, James Robinson
wrote:

Quantum Foam Guy wrote:

Oelewapper wrote:

Dear allies, welcome to the age of digital fascism... :

This is not "fascism", unless you're one of those morons who thinks dealing
with the DMV and getting fingerprinted for a driver's license is "fascism".

I do consider it fascism. I also have never had my fingerprints taken
for a driver's license in the US.

When you lace your writing with such stupid hyperbole, you've lost your
credibility.

If you can't see creeping totalitarianism, then you must be part of the
problem.

You're also mistaken if you think this will be limited to the US. Wealthy
democracies will all be implementing these very same procedures. If you
doubt me, wait and see what happens after the next round of terrorist
attacks.

Not so. Just look at Europe with is about to go to court to prevent
airlines from passing passenger information to the US TSA as a violation
of European privacy laws. They seem to take privacy much more seriously
than the US, even though there have been many more terrorist attacks in
their home countries. They don't see the need to give up their rights
like the supposedly "free" USA to tackle terrorism.

Exactly. The UK, Spain and other democracies have lived with terrorism
for many years. It is not always easy but it is important to keep a
balance between security and liberty. If you end up turning a country
in to a police state out of fear of terrorism, then the terrorists
have won.
--==++AJC++==--

"AJC" wrote

Exactly. The UK, Spain and other democracies have lived with terrorism
for many years. It is not always easy but it is important to keep a
balance between security and liberty. If you end up turning a country
in to a police state out of fear of terrorism, then the terrorists
have won.

If "the UK, Spain and other democracies have lived with terrorism for many
years.", evidently something isn't working right.

Unless of course you think living with terrorism is a desireable and natural
state of affairs.

Maybe it's time to try something different. Not saying that fingerprinting
everyone is the *right* solution, but something other than the status quo
would seem to be in order.

Pete