Possibly apocraphal story about Enola Gay display

On Sat, 29 May 2004 at 15:41:08 in message
ers.com, David
Megginson wrote:

1776-1783
1812-1815

(Apologies if I missed something in-between -- this is all from
memory.)

We suffer from just as much propaganda about the War of 1812 here in
Canada as you do in the U.S. I wouldn't suggest turning to the
schoolbooks of either Canada or the U.S. for an honest evaluation.

As a Briton I understand that you had some good reasons for declaring
war, but remember that the British at that time were fully occupied in
fighting the French in an attempt to defeat Napoleon.

We were understandably trying to stop any ships from supplying France
but we went too far after capturing American ships in forcing their
crews to fight for us on our ships!

Last September we visited Put-in-Bay Island in Lake Erie and the Perry
Memorial to the battle that Admiral Perry won on Lake Erie. The US also
invaded part of Canada I understand.

We are all friends since then I hope and a real peace treaty was signed
after that, although of course Napoleon was finally defeated in 1815
anyway.

When I visited the Perry memorial and the Visitor Centre there I was
delighted when everyone laughed when I said I had come to find out why
we lost!
--
David CL Francis

On Sat, 29 May 2004 at 09:41:40 in message
, Tom Sixkiller
wrote:

Is it even completely independant today? I notice stuff I have from Canada
(maps, etc) have some gibbersih about "Her Majesty the Queen"...

The British Queen is a constitutional monarch. She has no control over
Canada and almost zero over the UK. She is a figurehead.
--
David CL Francis

Paul Tomblin wrote:

I can't remember the book, but what I read said that the coastal states
wanted to go to war to stop the Royal Navy from boarding US ships at sea
to "impress" (aka "Shanghai") US citizens into Royal Navy service, but in
order to get states like Tennessee and Kentucky to vote for the war, they
promised them the chance to invade and loot Canada.

Dunno 'bout Kaintuck, but Tennessee was part of North Carolina in 1812. It had only
been opened up for settlement for about 15 years at the time.

George Patterson
None of us is as dumb as all of us.

David CL Francis wrote:

We were understandably trying to stop any ships from supplying France
but we went too far after capturing American ships in forcing their
crews to fight for us on our ships!

Actually, it was simpler than that. British captains were responsible for obtaining
crews for their ships. If they stopped American ships and kidnapped Americans for
their crews, it would take at least 9 months for the complaint to reach England, it
would almost certainly be ignored by the Admiralty, and they might well be dead by
then. The attitude of the British government on the matter was not the least
important to those captains. So the kidnappings continued.

George Patterson
None of us is as dumb as all of us.

Duck Dog wrote:

The American occupation authorities made a concerted effort to
revitalize Japan after the war (non-militarily, of course) in an
effort to create an ally in the region that would oppose communist
expansion.

Very well put. That's the basic situation - the area was going Communist, and we
badly needed a base in Asia that wasn't.

George Patterson
None of us is as dumb as all of us.

"David CL Francis"

When I visited the Perry memorial and the Visitor Centre there I was
delighted when everyone laughed when I said I had come to find out why
we lost!
--
David CL Francis

Nice place, isn't it? Many years ago, I used to spend a lot of time there,
and at the winery, but mostly used sailboats as my transportation. Everyone
knows sailboats are better to drive than airplanes, when you have a snoot
full! g

Was the Ford Trimotor still doing regular runs out to the islands?
--
Jim in NC


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Some up close displays of, for example, the cockpits would have been
tres cool. Just looking at the exteriors of planes just wasn't enough
for me, although I could've spent all day looking at the blackbird
(that thing was HUGE).

It's nice to be a journalist. I got to sit in the cockpit of the
AD/A-1 Skyraider at Pensacola, got the full tour of the B-36
Peacemaker at Wright-Patt, and likewise sat in the cockpit of the B-47
at New England Air Museum.

Small museums are great, while I was walking around NE Air Museum at
Windsor Locks, I noticed that there was a stairs set beside the
Corsair on display. I asked the docent about this, and he said that
every week? they had tours for schoolkids so they could sit in the
cockpit. I went into major whine mode, and sure enough he gave me the
nod to climb in. I could never have pulled that off at NASM.

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com

As to the rest, if
Yasukuni is not in Tokyo nor a shrine to war criminals, I would assume that Ms Chang
was not referring to Yasukuni.

Not at all. Iris Chang was wrong, plain and simple. She misplaced
Yasukuni and misunderstood its purpose. It is a shrine to the millions
who died in Japan's wars, in a much more ghostly fashion than
Arlington National Cemetery. The kamikaze would toast each other
before they went out on their one-way flights: "We will meet again at
Yasukuni."

Where Chang got hold of a half-truth is that the hanged war criminals
were also enshrined there, along with those officers and officials who
committed suicide at the end of the war. Thus Tojo made it in, along
with General Honma who defeated MacArthur in the Philippines. The
Japanese think these men were scapegoats, so find it perfectly natural
that they should be honored at Yasukuni. We think otherwise.

It's ironical that you should criticize the Japanese on the one hand
for not teaching their children about WWII, and on the other for
criticizing them for honoring the war dead at Yasukuni. Absent the
shrine, there wouldn't be any memorial to the war at all. (Well, there
would be the obelisk at ground zero at Hiroshima.)

all the best -- Dan Ford
email: (put Cubdriver in subject line)

The Warbird's Forum www.warbirdforum.com
The Piper Cub Forum www.pipercubforum.com

In a previous article, "G.R. Patterson III" said:
David CL Francis wrote:
We were understandably trying to stop any ships from supplying France
but we went too far after capturing American ships in forcing their
crews to fight for us on our ships!

then. The attitude of the British government on the matter was not the least
important to those captains. So the kidnappings continued.

I thought the attitude of the British government was that since the
American seaman being impressed were likely born as British citizens, it
was all legal and above board?


--
Paul Tomblin http://xcski.com/blogs/pt/
If you drink Real beer, you become horizontal... so, if you
drink Imaginary beer, you become vertical...
-- Thorfinn

"Cub Driver" wrote in message
...

It's ironical that you should criticize the Japanese on the one hand
for not teaching their children about WWII, and on the other for
criticizing them for honoring the war dead at Yasukuni. Absent the
shrine, there wouldn't be any memorial to the war at all. (Well, there
would be the obelisk at ground zero at Hiroshima.)

That sounds like a major drop in context...would you clarify?