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#11
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
"F. Baum" wrote in
: On May 25, 7:51*am, D Ramapriya wrote: Mighty lucky that there wasn't a fire and all crew are still alive...http: //edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/europe/05/25/belgium.aircrash.ap/in... Ramapriya WOW- glad these guys made it through. My guess based on past incedents would be a hard landing that went unreported or poorly inspected, or a cargo shift. Any ideas BTB ? Well, it was one of Connie's .... Straight away you know that something wasn't right. Bertie |
#12
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
Rich Ahrens wrote in
. net: on 5/25/2008 10:03 AM F. Baum said the following: On May 25, 7:51 am, D Ramapriya wrote: Mighty lucky that there wasn't a fire and all crew are still alive...http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/eu...belgium.aircra sh.ap/in... Ramapriya WOW- glad these guys made it through. My guess based on past incedents would be a hard landing that went unreported or poorly inspected, or a cargo shift. Any ideas BTB ? It's Kallita Air - no need to say more... But I'm sure Bertie will add to that. Same thing I thought straight away. Bertie |
#13
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
HARRY POTTER wrote in
: F. Baum wrote: On May 25, 7:51Â*am, D Ramapriya wrote: Mighty lucky that there wasn't a fire and all crew are still alive...http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/eu...elgium.aircras h .ap/in... Ramapriya WOW- glad these guys made it through. My guess based on past incedents would be a hard landing that went unreported or poorly inspected, or a cargo shift. Any ideas BTB ? please don't encourage him... Yeah, like I need encouragement. Bertie |
#14
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
On May 26, 10:10 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote:
Mxsmanic wrote innews D Ramapriya writes: Mighty lucky that there wasn't a fire and all crew are still alive... http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/eu...ircrash.ap/ind ex.html Too much cargo, perhaps. Fjukkwit./ He seems to have an obsession about overloaded aircraft... even when they ain't.... |
#15
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
george wrote in
: On May 26, 10:10 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote: Mxsmanic wrote innews D Ramapriya writes: Mighty lucky that there wasn't a fire and all crew are still alive... http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/eu....aircrash.ap/i nd ex.html Too much cargo, perhaps. Fjukkwit./ He seems to have an obsession about overloaded aircraft... even when they ain't.... We won't get into the Freuian aspects of all of that. Best guess is that they had some sort of problem near V1 and abandoned. Abandoned takeoffs are always a bit scary and the likelyhood of an over- run is high if they're done at a very high speed. Because of this we're encouraged to get our heads into go mode approaching V1 and we only stop for something absolutely drastic in the "high speed regime" which is usually between 80 knots and V1 wheras we stop for just about anything below 80. Bertie |
#16
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
B, I can appreciate the 'go mode' from some speed onward, but runway
lengths vary by some thousands of yards. With a typical load and normal conditions, how long a runway would allow you to decide to not go if something drastic happened at just below lift off speed (like a door blowing open, or a windscreen failing, something like that)? On May 25, 8:51 pm, Bertie the Bunyip wrote: george wrote : On May 26, 10:10 am, Bertie the Bunyip wrote: Mxsmanic wrote innews D Ramapriya writes: Mighty lucky that there wasn't a fire and all crew are still alive... http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/eu....aircrash.ap/i nd ex.html Too much cargo, perhaps. Fjukkwit./ He seems to have an obsession about overloaded aircraft... even when they ain't.... We won't get into the Freuian aspects of all of that. Best guess is that they had some sort of problem near V1 and abandoned. Abandoned takeoffs are always a bit scary and the likelyhood of an over- run is high if they're done at a very high speed. Because of this we're encouraged to get our heads into go mode approaching V1 and we only stop for something absolutely drastic in the "high speed regime" which is usually between 80 knots and V1 wheras we stop for just about anything below 80. Bertie |
#17
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
the original OP post
"Flydive" wrote in message ... BT wrote: Talk about a miss representation of facts.. no one yet knows the facts.. for some reason the aircraft did not have a successful take off.. more than likely an aborted take off, which caused the over running of the available runway and the aircraft broke apart because of the rough terrain I would doubt that the aircraft failed to take off because it broke in two.. parts would be more widely scattered. BT And where did you read that the aircraft failed to take oof because it broke? |
#18
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
Tina wrote in
: B, I can appreciate the 'go mode' from some speed onward, but runway lengths vary by some thousands of yards. With a typical load and normal conditions, how long a runway would allow you to decide to not go if something drastic happened at just below lift off speed (like a door blowing open, or a windscreen failing, something like that)? Actually, we probably wouldn't stop for something like that if we were close to V1. The actual recommended brief from MR Boeing these days is "We'll stop for an engine fire, an engine failure indicated by two parameters, or anything I reckon makes the airplane unsafe to fly" The last bit reinforces pilot discretion and allows us to make a decision based on our assessment in a given situation. For instance, though we're not supposed to, i did abandon for a belly cargo door unlocked light once. I was in the high speed regime, but still relatively slow ( about 110 knots) and we were light and the runway was quite long. No big deal and the stop was pretty much a non event. However, there's no way I would have stopped for that if I were close to V1 and the runway was short. Some people are already saying he put it back down aftger blowing a tire after airborne, whihc is almost certainly complete crap. We don't stop for tire burts in the high speed regime. Chances are you will also burst the adjoining tires and have very poor braking afterwards.. He might have doen this, but he'd have to be a very special class of idiot to have done so and it probably would have been a lot worse if he had in any case. But the decision speed is calculated for each runway, and should allow you to either go or stop at V1 in theory. IOW you can't take as much weight off a short runway as a long one, just like any other airplane. In actual fact overruns are common from high speed stops for a variety of reasons, not the least of which is the time it takes to assess the situation and make the decision. Usually they;re not as bad as this one, though. Quite possible they abandoned at a relatively high speed for whatever reason and just didn't get on the stoppers quickly enough, or , as someone suggested, there was a cargo shift, but that's pretty unlikely. Time and the report will tell, but it's quite possible that the crew will be found to have done everything correctly and they just ran out of runway.. Bertie |
#19
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
On May 25, 7:20 pm, "BT" wrote:
Talk about a miss representation of facts.. I merely typed out the CNN headline. snip Ramapriya |
#20
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747 cargo splits in two during takeoff!
"Tina" wrote B, I can appreciate the 'go mode' from some speed onward, but runway lengths vary by some thousands of yards. With a typical load and normal conditions, how long a runway would allow you to decide to not go if something drastic happened at just below lift off speed (like a door blowing open, or a windscreen failing, something like that)? Google "balanced field" and see what you find out. I'm not a heavy iron pilot, so I'm not positive that this concept flies here, (ooooh, bad pun, and I wasn't even trying for it g From what I understand, it is a calculation done before every takeoff, and it has to do with how far and how fast they will be able to go down the runway, and still abort and get stopped on the runway, safely. -- Jim in NC |
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