Cessna Over DC -- NASA Form?

"Dave S" wrote in message
k.net...


Gary Drescher wrote:

"Jonathan Goodish" wrote in message
...

If there are no consequences for busting the ADIZ, you might as well not
have the ADIZ.

Nevertheless, under current law and policy, there can be no enforcement
consequences if the ASRS immunity conditions are met (inadvertent,
non-criminal violation; no accident; ASRS report filed within ten days;
and no prior finding of FAR violation within five years).

--Gary

I know first hand of a pilot who busted a presidential TFR.. had the
F-16's flying off his wing. He was grounded for a few months. I dont see
how the NASA form saved him any.

Do you know if he filed the form? Did he have any other violations in the
previous five years?

--Gary

"Larry Dighera" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 11 May 2005 23:16:28 -0400, "Gary Drescher"
wrote in
::

Nevertheless, under current law and policy, there can be no enforcement
consequences if the ASRS immunity conditions are met (inadvertent,
non-criminal violation; no accident; ASRS report filed within ten days;
and
no prior finding of FAR violation within five years).

Would that preclude remedial training, testing?

You're right, that's a possibility. The FAA just can't take any *punitive*
action if the ASRS conditions are met.

--Gary

On Thu, 12 May 2005 03:37:23 GMT, Dave S
wrote in t::

I dont see how the NASA form saved him any.

Did he meet all the NASA qualifications?

In article ,
"Gary Drescher" wrote:

"Jonathan Goodish" wrote in message
...
If there are no consequences for busting the ADIZ, you might as well not
have the ADIZ.

Nevertheless, under current law and policy, there can be no enforcement
consequences if the ASRS immunity conditions are met (inadvertent,
non-criminal violation; no accident; ASRS report filed within ten days; and
no prior finding of FAR violation within five years).


I'm just saying that there need to be consequences, not that those
consequences have to come from the FAA. Of course, if I did something
like that and had these moron reporters stalking me, plastering my name
everywhere, and talking about a Cessna 150 like it was a 757, I don't
think I could find a rock big enough to hide under. Maybe that is
punishment enough.

My biggest issue is the deflection that takes place after these
incidents, or even aircraft accidents in general. The reason people
violate the ADIZ and prohibited areas, and bust airspace, and run out of
fuel, is due to poor planning and/or judgment on the part of the pilots,
not because the ADIZ exists, the airspace exists, or darn it, those
engines require fuel in order to keep running.



JKG

Plus, 44709 only allows revocation if the pilot's action impacts "the
safety of air commerce or air transportation and the public interest".
These guys might have might have acted against the public interest, but
I can't see any argument that they've impacted commerce or transport
safety being sustainable.

Martin,

He has to face all
charges maid possible by the Patriot Act et al (- terrorism).


Well, I may be a tad unfair, but frankly, I hope they carry him off to
Gitmo yesterday...

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

In article et, Mike Rapoport wrote:
Read 9 (c) (2) on your link. I would say that violating the airspace
constituted a lack of competency.

Almost anything a pilot may report on the ASRS form can constitute a
lack of competency though.

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

"Mike Granby" wrote in message
oups.com...

Plus, 44709 only allows revocation if the pilot's action impacts "the
safety of air commerce or air transportation and the public interest".
These guys might have might have acted against the public interest, but
I can't see any argument that they've impacted commerce or transport
safety being sustainable.

I think one could argue that if they'd been shot down over DC, it would've
adversely affected the safety of people on the ground. But 44709 only
provides for suspension or revocation if the pilot is deemed unable to fly
safely in the *future*; it can't be a punishment for past failures. If the
pilots brush up their rusty navigation skills (and their familiarity with
ADIZ and intercept procedures), there's no reason to think they'd be
significantly more likely than other pilots to bust the ADIZ *again*.

http://straylight.law.cornell.edu/us...9----000-.html

--Gary

"Martin Hotze" wrote in message


His certificate is the least he should worry about. He has to face all
charges maid possible by the Patriot Act et al (- terrorism).

No charges are being filed.

--
John T
http://tknowlogy.com/TknoFlyer
http://www.pocketgear.com/products_s...veloperid=4415
____________________

think one could argue that if they'd been shot
down over DC, it would've adversely affected
the safety of people on the ground.

Agreed. But that isn't air commerce or transportation.