Seminole-Lake Accident

On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 11:28:24 PM UTC-7, Heinz Gehlhaar wrote:
On Tuesday, April 7, 2020 at 6:35:22 PM UTC-7, Rich Owen wrote:
Seminole-Lake Gliderport sadly announces we had a fatal glider accident today. The accident will be investigated by the FAA and NTSB, an inspector was on the scene today. We do not want to identify the pilot but he was flying a Standard Cirrus that he owned. He was NOT in the Senior Soaring Championship. The accident occurred after a premature release by the pilot from tow at about 500 feet over the end of the runway. We recovered an Oudie and Nano (this unit was still operational) at the site and we expect it will greatly aid in the investigation. We ask you not call the office or come to the gliderport to view the scene. Seminole-Lake has been in the business of promoting soaring for over 50 years and this is our first fatal accident. Our prayers go out to the pilot's family.

Sincerely,
Rich Owen

My heart goes out to the Family and to the Glider Port Folks.
Just make sure that the Flight Computers (Oudi & Nano) really get read out by the powers to be. The local Sheriff and apparently the FAA do not know about igc-files.
I was involved in a glider retrieval wihich turned into an attempted accident retrieval around Ephrata, WA. When I got to the site, the Sheriff already there, and totally prevented access; even visual, as the glider was behind a slight rise in the country. I offered the Sheriff help in readout of the flight computer, but even that was refused. I left my name just in case, but was never contacted again. And the subsequent accident report years later looked like they had never seen the flight trace. Interestingly, since I had access to one of the flight-recorders on board, I saw that the wreck was moved a couple of days later.

Heinz is mistaken. I personally assisted the NTSB in locating the FLARM and the GPS-NAV onboard that accident. The NTSB included the IGC file and the analysis of the flight in their final report and that information is located he

https://dms.ntsb.gov/pubdms/search/h...6319AEB9E07248

I'll push back on the blanket condemnation of the FAA/NTSB. I should wait for someone with more specific knowledge to comment but my understanding is that they were quite conscientious and helpful in a recent accident investigation in our area.

My experience with the Feds has been mixed. Some are sharp, knowledgeable, open minded, and want to help. Others are self-important, insecure, blustering bureaucrats who jump to conclusions. It's a wide spectrum, sort of like with glider pilots, as we've seen on this forum from time to time.

Nothing is ever all good or bad. I suspect, as in most areas of our lives, how we behave and interact with the Feds has something to do with how they treat us. And that, in turn, probably has some impact on how they treat the next glider pilot they encounter.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24

On Wednesday, April 8, 2020 at 11:30:37 AM UTC-5, wrote:
I'll push back on the blanket condemnation of the FAA/NTSB. I should wait for someone with more specific knowledge to comment but my understanding is that they were quite conscientious and helpful in a recent accident investigation in our area.

My experience with the Feds has been mixed. Some are sharp, knowledgeable, open minded, and want to help. Others are self-important, insecure, blustering bureaucrats who jump to conclusions. It's a wide spectrum, sort of like with glider pilots, as we've seen on this forum from time to time.

Nothing is ever all good or bad. I suspect, as in most areas of our lives, how we behave and interact with the Feds has something to do with how they treat us. And that, in turn, probably has some impact on how they treat the next glider pilot they encounter.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24

Well said, Chip. And I'm very sorry to hear a fellow glider pilot is no longer with us. Condolences to their friends and family.

Mike Brooks
XL5

Sadly, I've got a box of shattered electronics sitting next to my office chair that came from the fatal accident of a good friend. After a lot of very dedicated and diligent work by the Pennsylvania State Police, FAA, and then the NTSB including the NTSB Electronics lab, they were able to recover the last few minutes of the flight from a badly fragged FLARM. Every one of the guys I dealt with was professional, caring, and interested in finding solutions.

That's not to say it was straightforward. They went down a few rabbit holes due to "procedures" that were frustrating at times. I had to invest some personal time to gain the confidence of the NTSB guy, but once that happened, they made me a formal party to the investigation and gave me full access to their information and findings. I think a lot of it depends on the usual relationship building skills. If you go in thinking they are a bunch of government hacks you'll probably find government hacks. If you approach them as professionals and show that you are willing and able to help, they are good guys.

Been my experience with most of the FAA guys I've dealt with over 30 years as well. Not perfect by any means, but decent enough guys if you come at them the right way.

Erik Mann
P3





On Wednesday, April 8, 2020 at 12:30:37 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I'll push back on the blanket condemnation of the FAA/NTSB. I should wait for someone with more specific knowledge to comment but my understanding is that they were quite conscientious and helpful in a recent accident investigation in our area.

My experience with the Feds has been mixed. Some are sharp, knowledgeable, open minded, and want to help. Others are self-important, insecure, blustering bureaucrats who jump to conclusions. It's a wide spectrum, sort of like with glider pilots, as we've seen on this forum from time to time.

Nothing is ever all good or bad. I suspect, as in most areas of our lives, how we behave and interact with the Feds has something to do with how they treat us. And that, in turn, probably has some impact on how they treat the next glider pilot they encounter.

Chip Bearden
ASW 24