The Apology

On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 2:02:22 AM UTC-4, Chip Bearden wrote:
We could debate whether the SSF ad was an unfortunate attempt at retro advertising--along the lines of "show her it's a man's world [with Van Heusen ties]"--that fell flat or if it were something more objectionable and sinister. It almost doesn't matter. In the old days, if we inadvertently offended or insulted someone, the obligatory response was to apologize, listen to the other person, and promise to learn and do better in the future. How quaint.

I read Bob's outraged howls that the women who complained to the SSA were threatening the existence of his way of life:

* ...an orchestrated attack on the publication , Editor, and the SSF. [an obvious conspiracy; the Russians? Chinese? Iranians?]
* The complainants are without merit, totally offbase and have a directive in place that only undermines the overall objective of the SSA, SSF, and Editor. [see "obvious conspiracy"; maybe we should refer this to the FBI]
* You would think that this bunch of misfits, have no understanding of how this is an inclusive activity and not directed by any one gender. ["Damnit, woman, do you not understand English? Get it through your sensitive skull that we're inclusive!"]

I waited for someone to slap him down for being more over the top than the letters themselves. Instead, this whole affair turned out to be a litmus test that revealed much more about male pilots' cluelessness, resentment, and anger at women than the ad did about women's allegedly delicate sensitivities:

* Somebody's gain is turned up WAY TOO HIGH! [read: "Calm down, little lady, we were just having some fun"]
* ...due to an insecure and suspicious attitude that the person asking feels inferior [if women weren't so insecure, this wouldn't be a problem]
* ...have become weak and lost focus on what is important, wasting time on petty stuff [yeah, this mutual respect stuff is pretty f***ing petty]
* ...Feminazi organizers whose mission was only to create conflict. This Femitifa approach should not be tolerated, solution, defund the WSPA as part or association with the SSA. [see "obvious conspiracy" theory, above; hey, maybe Nancy Pelosi is behind it]
* ...pretty butch [that didn't take long; the women writing in must be shrill, angry, man-hating Lesbians]
* ...what have you done for soaring? [I'll leave others to list the many female SSA members who have made enormous contributions as instructors, tow pilots, club members, SSA directors and officers, competitors, world record holders, gliderport owners/operators, and contest organizers, just to mention a few]
* ...what these females have done is dig a big hole, I don't think they have a shovel big enough to dig their way out. [true, an enormous hole has been dug, but not by the women who wrote in to register their concern]
* Getting upset today over something that happened decades ago, and was mainstream at the time, is simply someone wanting to stir up bad feelings. [insert alternative advert with a joke about limiting soaring clubs to whites only because, hey, segregation was mainstream decades ago]

Then, like a drunken frat party gone bad, things got mean:

* Any bitch who straps on a parachute... [finally, the "b" word! can the "c" word be far behind?]
* "You think it's offensive. I think it's funny. [should be fun next year sitting around the fire at New Castle exchanging hilarious jokes about women, Pollacks, blacks, Mexicans, Asians, Muslims, Jews, etc.]
* Oh, now the nuclear bomb - thanks A LOT, Linda. So, are you also going to take names and excommunicate pilots who disagree with you/Linda? [translation: "I don't give a f*** if you're angry, Linda; get your ass in that towplane and give me a tow"; very smooth, Tom]
* Reverting to the old boycott theory of punishment will further taint others opinions... [since when is it a boycott for one individual to decline to do business with a bunch of giggling, sophomoric, misogynistic, semi-literate, yuk-yuk, redneck louts? (relax, boys, I was just joking, sorry if you took offense)]
* And the woman in the ad would be more attractive if she had kept her mouth shut. [I'll have to remember that technique, Gregg--tell her she's ugly and she'll shut up]

And then more wisdom from the same source:

* Men are tired of this nonsense, threatening to stay away sounds too good to be true. [I suspect you'll be a lot happier now after expressing your views, Gregg]

Several others objected but most just piled on.

* "Much Ado About Nothing" [first prize for Most Succinct Cluelessness]
* The reality is the ladies were good sticks and way hotter! [if you're worried that you might have offended a female pilot, telling her she's hot is a guaranteed get-out-of-jail-free card; trust me!]
* ...if you think being a childless corporate whore is better than being a stay at home mother you need to talk to some honest women. [this is wrong on so many levels that I can't even begin to explain it, but it wouldn't be a discussion about gender roles if some man didn't use the term "whore". I'm waiting for "slut" to make its appearance, perhaps to describe any woman presumptuous enough to aspire to a career instead of sitting at home cooking for her hubby, grateful for all he has done for her.]

And then there's the "I ain't never had no complaints" defense:
* "I've met both complainant and the SSA President, both at the WSPA seminar at Black Forest in the early 90s and got along just fine with both."

If only these guys knew what was being said about them behind their backs.. One evening at a contest some years ago, I listened incredulously as a top-ranked pilot explained how his daughter, a successful professional, avoided discrimination by simply refusing to put up with it. He was amazed that women were getting so upset about something that was so easy to blunt. I looked over at several women competing in the contest and they just smiled. But as soon as this pilot left, they exploded in scornful laughter and indignation at how totally out of touch this guy was with what goes on in the workplace and society. He's highly thought of, a very good pilot, and has done much for soaring. But in his mind, discrimination and harrassment apparently only occur if women allow it. I'm sure these two successful career women have dealt with discrimination and harrassment in one form or another a lot. But I also suspect they choose to keep quiet and "get along just fine" with male pilots because they don't want to rock the boat or get labeled with any of the words and phrases above.

In my humble opinion, the SSF ad was likely a well-intentioned effort that misfired, and one that the SSA moved swiftly to address. But this thread is one of the most embarrassing things I've ever read in my 55 years in soaring. For many of those years, I've acknowledged that the notion that soaring pilots are an exceptionally fine group glosses over the reality that our sport has all types--including jerks--just like any other sport or activity. But I've never seen a worse public display by so many male soaring pilots as I've seen here.

I'm not perfect. I've made my share of insensitive, offensive remarks. That said, I think political correctness and wokeness have gone too far in some cases. But then I read something like this and realize we have a LONG way to go.

Chip Bearden
JB
Please let me issue an apology for referring to the women whom objected to the caption in the magazine as misfits, my choice of words was incorrect and I should have used the word radicals, for that mistake I truly apologize.
Often different points of view, or perspectives are overlooked just by pure mistake, but the consensus that the SSA and others were insensitive is not correct. I have spoken with several women about this depiction and the assertion that it was insensitive and sexist and the findings are to the contrary. Of about 20 or so women whom I have shown the depiction to and also the complaints not a single woman has see the sexist depiction of the print.
For your information my wife is a sailplane pilot, single engine pilot and multi engine pilot. She was hired once to help defend a lawsuit brought about by the plaintiff who asserted that the aircraft was beyond the individuals capability causing him and his instructor passenger to perish in a nice King Air. When approached she was told of the incident and asked to fly and do the same maneuvers as the lost pilots. She never looked at this as sexist, she looked at it as an opportunity.
Now you are certainly entitled to make any remarks that you seem appropriate in regard to my original post, I will not apologize for my opinions, nor do I expect you to apologize for yours, we just look at things differently.
What I do think is that we agree on some of the issues that were exposed in this thread, the pendulum has swung way too far in both directions. I remember seeing the pink Cadillac and the Mary Kay sign on the door, I guess that those are now sexist? Or what about the day when the decision was made to have bi-gender restrooms and then the sign was placed above the urinal for all men to lower the seat when finished, shouldn't the sign have read, Ladies, please raise the seat when you are finished. Would that not have been more appropriate in this world void of sexism.
I towed probably 15 gliders yesterday, both genders, not once did I say to myself or others as to their abilities because of their gender. As I looked at the mirrors I was more concerned about their safety than I was mine! Oh, and by the way, I think my wife is a member of the WSPA, she will outwork any male at the club, move gliders in and out of the hangar, and gets in her fiberglass glider just like yours and can fly as well or better than any male counterpart.
SO, I hope you and others that disagree have a better understanding about different perceptions. I wish you well, stay healthy and enjoy flying your sailplane. Bob

This picture is the earliest picture I can find of the gang of girls, 1939 Wiesbaden. Hard to imagine just a generation later, but the women in the picture had to fight for the vote, equal pay, and other important human rights. However I always wondered what they were thinking when they quietly endured face to face discrimination. One day I asked the woman on the far left and she said: “living well is my best revenge.�

https://photos.app.goo.gl/rDrC7aLiV5rkXpKf7

On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 6:40:46 AM UTC-4, xcnick wrote:
This picture is the earliest picture I can find of the gang of girls, 1939 Wiesbaden. Hard to imagine just a generation later, but the women in the picture had to fight for the vote, equal pay, and other important human rights. However I always wondered what they were thinking when they quietly endured face to face discrimination. One day I asked the woman on the far left and she said: “living well is my best revenge.�

https://photos.app.goo.gl/rDrC7aLiV5rkXpKf7

What Cindy, Hugh and Chip said (and much more articulately and on point than my try).

On Sunday, October 25, 2020 at 6:40:46 AM UTC-4, xcnick wrote:
This picture is the earliest picture I can find of the gang of girls, 1939 Wiesbaden. Hard to imagine just a generation later, but the women in the picture had to fight for the vote, equal pay, and other important human rights. However I always wondered what they were thinking when they quietly endured face to face discrimination. One day I asked the woman on the far left and she said: “living well is my best revenge.�

https://photos.app.goo.gl/rDrC7aLiV5rkXpKf7
Exactly women have been flying since the beginning of flying. Women flying in modern times are not pioneers, they are just pilots. And to be outraged over that illustration is almost as retarded as defending the outrage.

Exactly women have been flying since the beginning of flying. Women flying in modern times are not pioneers, they are just pilots. And to be outraged over that illustration is almost as retarded as defending the outrage.

So that makes it ok to refer to them as "childless corporate whores" and say that they would be more attractive if they kept their mouth's shut, Gregg?

You really can see why they send Borat to the US of A to make films. Some
of you really are the gift that just keeps giving.

Oh, I know he's not real. !!!!!







At 16:34 25 October 2020, Hugh Grandstaff wrote:

Exactly women have been flying since the beginning of flying. Women
flying in modern times are not pioneers, they are just pilots. And to be
outraged over that illustration is almost as retarded as defending the
outrage.

So that makes it ok to refer to them as "childless corporate whores" and
say that they would be more attractive if they kept their mouth's shut,
Gregg?

"that they would be more attractive if they kept their mouth's shut, XXXX?"

I opened my mouth, and it was suggested this would be a way to redirect
the triple dog dare . . . . .

If you have been offended either way in this thread,
you should know you have an option for a more productive outcome,
rather than spewing dissonance.

https://tinyurl.com/y6n9sxzk

WSPA is always thankful for contributions. They can be general, or specific
to any WSPA program. WSPA has no paid staff, and is a 501 c)3 organization.
https://womensoaring.org/

Thank you to my many male and female customers, students and friends over the years.
Many generous people have given time, equipment and dollars to my pilotage.
Without their love of soaring, I wouldn't have been able to make a living in
this sport for many years.

Cindy B

Chip,

"...have become weak and lost focus on what is important, wasting time on petty stuff [yeah, this mutual respect stuff is pretty f***ing petty]"

1. There is no need to use swear words to make your point (asterisks do not hide the real word).

2. I have not and will not support anything that promotes disrespecting women.

3. I do not think there was any "malicious attempt" by the ad submitter to squeeze in a sexist nostalgic ad. Nowadays, everyone is super conscious not to do anything to offend anyone, where even innocent things may be deemed evil.

4. I showed my wife the image and she did NOT find anything objectionable with it.

5. And yes, I still stand firmly by my opinion "...have become weak and lost focus on what is important, wasting time on petty stuff". - America, as a nation is destroying itself from within. We will NOT need our enemies (Russia, Iran, N Korea, etc.) to do it for us. If there is anything to worry, whine, or complain about, there are much bigger things than the image in question.

Chip,
"...have become weak and lost focus on what is important, wasting time on petty stuff [yeah, this mutual respect stuff is pretty f***ing petty]"
1. There is no need to use swear words to make your point (asterisks do not hide the real word).

2. I have not and will not support anything that promotes disrespecting women.

3. I do not think there was any "malicious attempt" by the ad submitter to squeeze in a sexist nostalgic ad. Nowadays, everyone is super conscious not to do anything to offend anyone, where even innocent things may be deemed evil.

4. I showed my wife the image and she did NOT find anything objectionable with it.

5. And yes, I still stand firmly by my opinion "...have become weak and lost focus on what is important, wasting time on petty stuff". - America, as a nation is destroying itself from within. We will NOT need our enemies (Russia, Iran, N Korea, etc.) to do it for us. If there is anything to worry, whine, or complain about, there are much bigger things than the image in question.

Just to make sure I clearly understand your positions he

A group of women write to the editors of a small magazine expressing their displeasure at an advertisement. They are taken seriously, and a considerate apology is published in the same magazine.

-"America has lost focus on what is important and is wasting time on petty stuff! America, as a nation is destroying itself from within. We will NOT need our enemies (Russia, Iran, N Korea, etc.) to do it for us. If there is anything to worry, whine, or complain about, there are much bigger things than the image in question."

Somebody uses asterisks in place of writing what you consider fowl language (because clearly the word was duck...see what I did there?)

-"THERE IS NO NEED TO USE SWEAR WORDS TO MAKE YOUR POINT"

People on here compared women to Nazis, Fascists, whores, and wished they were more subservient because they were willing to voice their discomfort about an advertisement.

-"........................"

Did I get that right?

Dan emailed me about the women in the picture. Sorry buddy, but couldn't get through your spam filter. However:

This is a group photo at a gathering of women soaring pilots for a building workshop. They are holding a rudder that has yet to be covered. These ladies are from many nations making me think their loyalty to each other is greater than the dangerous nationalism sweeping the world at this time.

There was only one true femanazi. But man, did she have a nice whip!

https://photos.app.goo.gl/18NbBTdNCugviDLt6

https://photos.app.goo.gl/3WqHnp1p3Epz1itZ7