The Apology

Sign the petition. http://chng.it/2qk7Cwq64Y

Yours truly,
Cumungus

On Monday, October 26, 2020 at 5:22:40 PM UTC-4, Cumungus wrote:
Sign the petition. http://chng.it/2qk7Cwq64Y

Yours truly,
Cumungus
Comungus, I was in court all morning taking care of business, when all was said and done the local glider club will benefit from my directed donation of all funds collected. Let me ask you, what have you done.

I want to add my voice to those who have already posted that they understand why the ad was so cringeworthy.

When I first skimmed over it in print it elicited a "something's not quite right" reaction in the back of my brain, but I didn't really pause to think about it (perhaps I should have). On reflection, it doesn't surprise me at all that a significant number of very accomplished women glider pilots might feel a snub at being portrayed in by the senior representatives of the sport (SSF and the Editors of Soaring) as basking in the glow of the dashing and adventuresome man who performs daring feats of airmanship that women can't even comprehend on their own - and that their trajectory in the sport is to become romantically involved with such a man. That's the obvious implication of the content of the ad - probably unintentional and based on a set of subconscious presumptions about what's nostalgic versus rubbing salt in a wound. Just because something is subconscious and counter to what a person might support explicitly doesn't make its impact less corrosive. I'd also note that it appears that the "thought bubble" was added to the retro material by whomever put the ad together so the "historical graphic" seems to have had its more objectionable presumptions reinforced by contemporary sentiments. People should think about that - it's unlikely that this ad was written as irony and even if it was, it doesn't come across that way. In either case it's a fail and a corrective statement is wholly appropriate.

Pointing out the obvious shortcomings of a not-so-subtle diminishing of women's place in our sport is not an assault of freedom or a liberal conspiracy to "cancel" men, a "PC takeover" by overly sensitive snowflakes, or anything of the sort. It's simply pointing out that these sorts of obvious to some but (apparently) oblivious to others slights get noticed and cumulatively diminish the enjoyment of those women who do participate in soaring. These representations also erode the propensity to join of 50% of the population who might consider our sport. That's hardly a group we should be writing off - their participation rate is tragically small as it stands.

A very wise person once told me "feedback is a gift". People have to screw up their courage and make an effort to provide you with an opportunity to learn and grow. Defensiveness is the enemy of understanding - and vitriolic ad hominem reactions are simply indefensible. I have to admit true astonishment at those who have run off to some woman in their life to ask "this isn't sexist, right?". That's hardly a defense of anything.

My hope is that most of us can learn something of value from this episode. I certainly have.

Andy Blackburn
9B

On Monday, October 26, 2020 at 7:10:07 PM UTC-4, wrote:
I want to add my voice to those who have already posted that they understand why the ad was so cringeworthy.

When I first skimmed over it in print it elicited a "something's not quite right" reaction in the back of my brain, but I didn't really pause to think about it (perhaps I should have). On reflection, it doesn't surprise me at all that a significant number of very accomplished women glider pilots might feel a snub at being portrayed in by the senior representatives of the sport (SSF and the Editors of Soaring) as basking in the glow of the dashing and adventuresome man who performs daring feats of airmanship that women can't even comprehend on their own - and that their trajectory in the sport is to become romantically involved with such a man. That's the obvious implication of the content of the ad - probably unintentional and based on a set of subconscious presumptions about what's nostalgic versus rubbing salt in a wound. Just because something is subconscious and counter to what a person might support explicitly doesn't make its impact less corrosive. I'd also note that it appears that the "thought bubble" was added to the retro material by whomever put the ad together so the "historical graphic" seems to have had its more objectionable presumptions reinforced by contemporary sentiments. People should think about that - it's unlikely that this ad was written as irony and even if it was, it doesn't come across that way. In either case it's a fail and a corrective statement is wholly appropriate.

Pointing out the obvious shortcomings of a not-so-subtle diminishing of women's place in our sport is not an assault of freedom or a liberal conspiracy to "cancel" men, a "PC takeover" by overly sensitive snowflakes, or anything of the sort. It's simply pointing out that these sorts of obvious to some but (apparently) oblivious to others slights get noticed and cumulatively diminish the enjoyment of those women who do participate in soaring. These representations also erode the propensity to join of 50% of the population who might consider our sport. That's hardly a group we should be writing off - their participation rate is tragically small as it stands.

A very wise person once told me "feedback is a gift". People have to screw up their courage and make an effort to provide you with an opportunity to learn and grow. Defensiveness is the enemy of understanding - and vitriolic ad hominem reactions are simply indefensible. I have to admit true astonishment at those who have run off to some woman in their life to ask "this isn't sexist, right?". That's hardly a defense of anything.

My hope is that most of us can learn something of value from this episode.. I certainly have.

Andy Blackburn
9B
Andy, nice interpretation of your point of view. I would like to ask you the question in reference to this depiction topic only. Are the women or men more subtly sensitive about the depiction? I was just reading something called the Woman Enemy, which pretty much came to the conclusion that 95% of sexist facts were undermined by other women. Maybe I should go back and read the, The rules Of The Feminists' Fight Club". I do not mean to rub in salt as you stated, just looking for a better understanding. Bob

On Monday, October 26, 2020 at 4:22:40 PM UTC-5, Cumungus wrote:
Sign the petition. http://chng.it/2qk7Cwq64Y

Yours truly,
Cumungus

I have no desire to see anyone banned from the SSA over this.

I do have a desire to point out what is unacceptable behavior and hopefully see some change. I would much rather have someone take a breath, think about the fact their actions and words can have real consequences with regard to how they are perceived, and decide that they will modify the way that they interact with their fellow human beings rather than be completely alienated from the sport and community.

On Monday, October 26, 2020 at 5:22:40 PM UTC-4, Cumungus wrote:
Sign the petition. http://chng.it/2qk7Cwq64Y

Yours truly,
Cumungus
Damn the soaring social justice cancel culture is harsh. I'm not one of those holocaust deniers, I just think the ladies overreacted to an innocent illustration.

Just to ensure we don't get some weakened, wattered down thing at the end of this thread where people never see the true hate which has spewed from these posters, I will provide quotes, with references after the last post by either Bob or Greg for as long as it takes for this thread to go away. These quotes need to be preserved for the life of the internet, and serve as a reminder to customers, potential club members, and future employers.

"Mark, you make a great point , the apology should be from these Feminazi organizers whose mission was only to create conflict. This Femitifa approach should not be tolerated, solution, defund the WSPA as part or association with the SSA. "
-Bob Youngblood, Vero Beach, Florida, Oct 20, 2020, 12:03:12

"The complaints and the sniveling apologies are appalling. And the woman in the ad would be more attractive if she had kept her mouth shut."
-Greg Ballou, Elmwood, Massachusits, Oct 21, 2020, 12:49:44

"Poor women, women have lost a lot since the 1950's if you think being a childless corporate whore is better than being a stay at home mother you need to talk to some honest women.
-Greg Ballou, Elmwood, Massachusits, Oct 23, 2020, 4:24:47

On Tuesday, October 27, 2020 at 6:22:37 AM UTC-7, Kimmine and Mitch Hudson wrote:
Just to ensure we don't get some weakened, wattered down thing at the end of this thread where people never see the true hate which has spewed from these posters, I will provide quotes, with references after the last post by either Bob or Greg for as long as it takes for this thread to go away. These quotes need to be preserved for the life of the internet, and serve as a reminder to customers, potential club members, and future employers.

"Mark, you make a great point , the apology should be from these Feminazi organizers whose mission was only to create conflict. This Femitifa approach should not be tolerated, solution, defund the WSPA as part or association with the SSA. "
-Bob Youngblood, Vero Beach, Florida, Oct 20, 2020, 12:03:12

"The complaints and the sniveling apologies are appalling. And the woman in the ad would be more attractive if she had kept her mouth shut."
-Greg Ballou, Elmwood, Massachusits, Oct 21, 2020, 12:49:44

"Poor women, women have lost a lot since the 1950's if you think being a childless corporate whore is better than being a stay at home mother you need to talk to some honest women.
-Greg Ballou, Elmwood, Massachusits, Oct 23, 2020, 4:24:47

Just to balance this:

"Few men are 'pigs'. But those few might cloud the perception of swine." Cindy B

On Tuesday, October 27, 2020 at 9:22:37 AM UTC-4, Kimmine and Mitch Hudson wrote:
Just to ensure we don't get some weakened, wattered down thing at the end of this thread where people never see the true hate which has spewed from these posters, I will provide quotes, with references after the last post by either Bob or Greg for as long as it takes for this thread to go away. These quotes need to be preserved for the life of the internet, and serve as a reminder to customers, potential club members, and future employers.

"Mark, you make a great point , the apology should be from these Feminazi organizers whose mission was only to create conflict. This Femitifa approach should not be tolerated, solution, defund the WSPA as part or association with the SSA. "
-Bob Youngblood, Vero Beach, Florida, Oct 20, 2020, 12:03:12

"The complaints and the sniveling apologies are appalling. And the woman in the ad would be more attractive if she had kept her mouth shut."
-Greg Ballou, Elmwood, Massachusits, Oct 21, 2020, 12:49:44
"Poor women, women have lost a lot since the 1950's if you think being a childless corporate whore is better than being a stay at home mother you need to talk to some honest women.
-Greg Ballou, Elmwood, Massachusits, Oct 23, 2020, 4:24:47
Looking at things through a different perspective is usually educational and enlightening. According to the Oxford dictionary the term Feminazi is American slang meaning "Strong Willed Woman". The term Feminazi originated more than two decades ago prior to your favorite radio host Rush Limbaugh using it in his first book, "The Way Things Ought To Be". Actually professor Tom Hazlett a regarded professor of economics from the University Of California Davis coined the term. In the words of a female author the term is described as an exaggerated description of a woman's right to advocate so ardently for gender equality that she becomes harshly domineering, dictatorial or intolerant.
MS or modern sexism measures covert or subtle form of sexism, IMHO the depiction was either overt or blatant, the radicals perceived it as blatant and then the complaints were registered, at that point the apologies were written and all hell broke out.
I mentioned earlier that my wife was involved with defense lawsuit against Beechcraft, she was chosen to go through the same program as the perished pilot. The question was asked of me did I think she was chosen because she was a female and that would be one step higher than a chimp for the defense, mind you, it was a female that asked that question. My reply was direct and to the point, "My Wife Took That As An Opportunity, Not Taking Would Have Done More Damage To Her Advancements In Female Aviation, sorry you do not feel the same way.
In an earlier post Dan mentioned the removal of the sexist pictures from the workplace except for the boob clock. I had a similar experience when a young Feminazi demanded that a wall picture of a B-17 with great nose art of a big boob sexy lady be removed from a mans office. Fortunately she was not successful, the picture was of the B-17 that his father gave his life for in WWll. Yet she was the Feminazi that came to the office most every day with her very revealing tits exposing in a n extremely revealing top, I could not help just taking a look at those puppies from time to time. In your eyes I guess that made me a sexist.
Let me close this by saying, there is such thing as cause and effect, Taking something completely out of context and making it a bigger issue that it should be is the real problem .
I probably have said enough on this issue, I hope that I have enlightened you and a few others . Bob Youngblood

Just a quick recap for everyones Google search pleasure.

"Yet she was the Feminazi that came to the office most every day with her very revealing tits exposing in a n extremely revealing top, I could not help just taking a look at those puppies from time to time. In your eyes I guess that made me a sexist.
-Bob Youngblood, Vero Beach, Florida, October 27th, 2:43PM

"Mark, you make a great point , the apology should be from these Feminazi organizers whose mission was only to create conflict. This Femitifa approach should not be tolerated, solution, defund the WSPA as part or association with the SSA. "
-Bob Youngblood, Vero Beach, Florida, Oct 20, 2020, 12:03:12

"The complaints and the sniveling apologies are appalling. And the woman in the ad would be more attractive if she had kept her mouth shut."
-Greg Ballou, Elmwood, Massachusits, Oct 21, 2020, 12:49:44

"Poor women, women have lost a lot since the 1950's if you think being a childless corporate whore is better than being a stay at home mother you need to talk to some honest women.
-Greg Ballou, Elmwood, Massachusits, Oct 23, 2020, 4:24:47

-Mitch