Help - I busted into the Class B SEATAC airspace last night, does anyone have any advice ?

sdfsdf wrote:


I believe it is easier to bust the Bravo using TK or DTK up as I find that
students then only have an idea of their position in relation to their
track, whereas North up enables them to relate the GPS image to their
sectional chart.


TK up is better when you know where you are. North up is
probably better if you don't and are trying to compare GPS
to the sectional.
Todd Pattist
(Remove DONTSPAMME from address to email reply.)
___
Make a commitment to learn something from every flight.
Share what you learn.

TK up is for mouth breathing invertebrates who never really learned to
formulate a map in their head which they compare to the sectional and
any other nav instruments they may be using.

I see people like this all the time, they have to rotate their sectional
chart whenever they change heading or they will get confused. These are
the same people that get lost when flying south because now left on the
map does not mean left in the world.

I have found that pilots navigating with GPS most often loose
situational awareness when using TK up than using North up. The folks
using TK up know only that they are heading toward whatever they punched
in for "Direct To". These are the people that cannot adequately tell
ATC their location in reference to a nearby town or airport because they
can't relate their left and right to north and south.

As you mentioned in the first sentence of your post, "TK up is better
when you know where you are." You folks flying around with TK up
because it appears to be easier, you are just asking for a navigation
related airspace bust.

Most pilots using GPS as their primary means of navigation don't know
exactly where they are, so by your statement they should probably be
using North Up. If they knew where they were they wouldn't be using the
GPS.



Todd Pattist wrote in
:

sdfsdf wrote:


TK up is better when you know where you are. North up is
probably better if you don't and are trying to compare GPS
to the sectional.
Todd Pattist
(Remove DONTSPAMME from address to email reply.)
___
Make a commitment to learn something from every flight.
Share what you learn.

"wtfcfi" wrote in message
news:nWimb.20178$e01.38578@attbi_s02...

TK up is for mouth breathing invertebrates who never really learned to
formulate a map in their head which they compare to the sectional and
any other nav instruments they may be using. [remainder of drivel
snipped]

lol...

This being the Usenet, you haven't come close to posting the most idiotic
message of the year. But that doesn't mean it approached being sensible.

Different people navigate different ways. Your claims regarding someone
"just asking for a navigation related airspace bust" is completely
unfounded, and I guarantee you have no data to support it. Beyond that,
your willingness to dimiss someone as incompetent just because they use a
technique to navigate that you don't like or appreciate is the mark of a
fool.

Pete

your willingness to dimiss someone as incompetent just because they use a
technique to navigate that you don't like or appreciate is the mark of a
fool.

Well said! But, you forgot, "or can afford".

"wtfcfi" wrote in message
news:nWimb.20178$e01.38578@attbi_s02...

TK up is for mouth breathing invertebrates who never really learned to
formulate a map in their head which they compare to the sectional and
any other nav instruments they may be using.

I see people like this all the time, they have to rotate their sectional
chart whenever they change heading or they will get confused. These are
the same people that get lost when flying south because now left on the
map does not mean left in the world.

I have found that pilots navigating with GPS most often loose
situational awareness when using TK up than using North up.

Bla, Bla, Bla,_________________________


Halleluiah!!!

You need to get to FlightSafety immediately and notify them of this!!!

My training with them every 6 months for the past 24 years in various
aircraft, Falcon, Lear, Beech stress TRACK up on the main MFD. No wonder us
corporate pilots are always lost*************

They need your help!!


Karl

Do you really mean that


karl gruber wrote:
No wonder us

corporate pilots are always lost*************

They need your help!!

Karl

Really? I find it makes little difference what mode I use, I do fine either
way. Why should it matter? You either have a mental picture or you don't.


"karl gruber" wrote in message
...

"wtfcfi" wrote in message
news:nWimb.20178$e01.38578@attbi_s02...

TK up is for mouth breathing invertebrates who never really learned to
formulate a map in their head which they compare to the sectional and
any other nav instruments they may be using.

I see people like this all the time, they have to rotate their sectional
chart whenever they change heading or they will get confused. These are
the same people that get lost when flying south because now left on the
map does not mean left in the world.

I have found that pilots navigating with GPS most often loose
situational awareness when using TK up than using North up.

Bla, Bla, Bla,_________________________


Halleluiah!!!

You need to get to FlightSafety immediately and notify them of this!!!

My training with them every 6 months for the past 24 years in various
aircraft, Falcon, Lear, Beech stress TRACK up on the main MFD. No wonder
us
corporate pilots are always lost*************

They need your help!!


Karl

"Peter Gottlieb" wrote in message
. net...
Really? I find it makes little difference what mode I use, I do fine
either
way. Why should it matter? You either have a mental picture or you
don't.

My impression was that Karl's post was sarcastic. The "Bla, Bla, Bla" at
the beginning was the big clue.

Oh. Well then I missed it. I'm not a morning person and I had to get up at
5 am today, so anything's possible..


"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...
"Peter Gottlieb" wrote in message
. net...
Really? I find it makes little difference what mode I use, I do fine
either
way. Why should it matter? You either have a mental picture or you
don't.

My impression was that Karl's post was sarcastic. The "Bla, Bla, Bla" at
the beginning was the big clue.

"wtfcfi" wrote in message
news:nWimb.20178$e01.38578@attbi_s02...
|
| TK up is for mouth breathing invertebrates who never really learned to
| formulate a map in their head which they compare to the sectional and
| any other nav instruments they may be using.
|
|
| I have found that pilots navigating with GPS most often loose
| situational awareness when using TK up than using North up.

This, from a guy who does not know the difference between 'loose' and
'lose.'

Loser.