TSA Considers Wiping Egg From Face Re. GA.

On 27 Oct 2003 19:11:51 GMT, (Teacherjh)
wrote in Message-Id: :



I blame Osama only for opening the eyes [...] to the vulnerability...


It is the fundamental nature of an open society that it is vulnerable....

And your point is?


My point is that "opening our eyes" to the vulnerability is not much of an
accomplishment, any more than throwing somebody out a forty ninth story window
"opens our eyes" to the vulnerability of high apartments with glass windows.

So you're saying the vulnerability of an open society is obvious to
ALL the people of the world? Doubtful. I believe we were perceived
by the people of the world as mighty and all powerful.

Now it has become apparent that a band of bedouin thugs can kill
thousands and inflict hundreds of millions of dollars in damages in
the US through will and planning alone.

If the vulnerability had been obvious, one would think that those
government agencies charged with the nation's safety would have taken
steps to prevent the type of terrorist attacks we witnessed on
September 11, 2001. You know, little things like having a plan of
action when an airliner deviates from its flight plan after disabling
transponder squawking, air martials, armed airline staff, ... Now
that our vulnerability can no longer be denied, (inappropriate?) steps
are being taken to attempt to close the gaps in our security. But as
you assert, it is virtually impossible in an open society.

You have failed to convince me that the US did not lose a lot of
stature in the eyes of the world as a result of the attacks.


[Nowhere did I use the words "opening our eyes" as you have. What I
said in Message-ID: was,
"Osama's strike at the icons of our "invincible" nation have forever
done their damage in the eyes of the people of the world."]

So you're saying the vulnerability of an open society is obvious to
ALL the people of the world?


Well, I'm saying it's pretty obvious to anybody who has lived in an open
society and has taken some time to think about it. It's also obvous to anyone
who has thought about how to attack an open society.


If the vulnerability had been obvious, one would think that [...]
government [...] would have taken steps to prevent...


It did. It missed one. Total security is not possible in an open society,
much as "the people" might want to be led otherwise. Airports are vulnerable,
no matter how many fences we put up and no matter how many locks we have to put
on our aircraft. Cities are vulnerable to air attack no matter how many TFRs
go up, unless all aircraft are dismantled and pounded into the ground.


You have failed to convince me that the US did not lose a lot of
stature in the eyes of the world as a result of the attacks.


I wasn't trying to. I wasn't even addressing "stature". I was addressing the
point that the 9/11 attacks somehow revealed something to us.


[Nowhere did I use the words "opening our eyes" as you have.


in message id: you
(Larry Dighera
Date: 10/27/03 9:33 AM Eastern Standard Time) said:
(after quoting people)

I blame Osama only for opening the eyes of the American people and the
world to the vulnerability to significant hostile attack of our
historically strategically isolated nation.


I agree with your sentiment, and go further.

Osama and his gang is responsible for killing thousands of people and
destroying parts of lower Manhattan.
WE are responsible for our reaction to it:

Jose



--
(for Email, make the obvious changes in my address)

On 27 Oct 2003 21:56:06 GMT, (Teacherjh)
wrote in Message-Id: :


Total security is not possible in an open society,...

Agreed.

Osama and his gang is responsible for killing thousands of people and
destroying parts of lower Manhattan. WE are responsible for our reaction to it:

That seems reasonable.