Perfect electro-magnetic storm

("Larry Dighera" wrote)
snippy
I did not call YOU inane. I was referring to the often shallow
attempts at humor you routinely post. At least the signature line is
aviation related. Some folks like to read attempts at humor; I prefer
information.

And I enjoy your attempts at information Larry :-)

"Cat fight" was funny! Not shallow - funny.

"I know funny" is a quote from Good Morning Vietnam (1987) Unfortunately the
next line is "...and that's not funny." Let's move on ...

I was at a banquet Saturday night talking with the guy who organized the
National Air Tour. He mostly flew the Pilatus support plane. Talk about
funny stories - he's got some about the tour. ...but those stories are not
welcome here no more. :-(

This isn't a PhD dissertation newsgroup, it's a hangar flying newsgroup. We
all have our own styles. Mine is more relaxed and well, playful - for lack
of a better word. Shallow it is not! Says me.

So there.

- Airplane (1980)

(See, much of what I post is aviation related.)

--
Montblack
"Just the usual inanity"

Montblack wrote:

And I enjoy your attempts at information Larry :-)

ROTFL!

George Patterson
You can dress a hog in a tuxedo, but he still wants to roll in the mud.

On Wed, 29 Oct 2003 13:52:10 -0600, "Montblack"
wrote in Message-Id:
:

And I enjoy your attempts at information Larry :-)

Thank you.

If you'll take the time to read the charter of this newsgroup , you'll
note the first word is 'information' not 'jocularity', but pertinent
INFORMATION.

The charter of rec.aviation.piloting is:


************************************************** **************************
* Information pertinent to pilots of general aviation aircraft
* which would not fall into one of the other non-misc
* rec.aviation groups. Topics include, but are not limited to
* flying skills, interesting sights, destinations, flight
* characteristics of aircraft, unusual situations, handling
* emergencies, working with air traffic control, international
* flights, customs and immigration, experiences with ground
* support facilities, etc.

************************************************** **************************

Perhaps it's time to charter a new newsgroup:
rec.aviation.hangar-flying. We could post a Request For Discussion in
the rec.aviation.* hierarchy. Just a thought. And then those who
thrive on frivolity can have a place all their own to share their
pearls with each other. We could imposed an X-Archive=no header
requirement for articles posted to rec.aviation.hangar-flying, so that
the articles would be excluded from the public archive. Perhaps you'd
be willing to shoulder the task of drafting a charter for the proposed
newsgroup.

I see the intended content of rec.aviation.piloting more as an
informational resource and news exchange medium among responsible
airmen, than a hee-haw party line despite the fact that many would
prefer to reduce it to that. The choice is ours.

I was at a banquet Saturday night talking with the guy who organized the
National Air Tour. He mostly flew the Pilatus support plane. Talk about
funny stories - he's got some about the tour. ...but those stories are not
welcome here no more. :-(

Your self-imposed restraint is noted (despite your double-negative).

Perhaps the substance of the "guys" talk would be a more appropriate
subject for you to share with us in this PUBLIC forum.

This isn't a PhD dissertation newsgroup, it's a hangar flying newsgroup.

What you overlook is the PUBLIC nature of usenet in general (which is
publicly archived for posterity), and specifically the image of pilots
the lay public carries away from reading rec.aviation.piloting.
Again, the choice is ours.

In this time, when GA is being singled out as an expendable "kick dog"
by those bureaucracies in charge of national security, the military,
and airlines, ..., I believe it is in the best interest of all airmen
to put forth to the public our best face, our sober dedication to
responsibility and professionalism, rather than portray ourselves the
as frivolous clowns recklessly cavorting over the heads of the
ground-bound public as the media continually attempt.

Perhaps we should all consider how what we're about to post reflects
on our fellows. My fear is, that if we fail to police ourselves,
restrictive measures will be arbitrarily imposed upon us by those with
the power to advance their own agenda. Please, let's don't give them
any ammunition here.

I realize that my views will likely be ridiculed by those who are
incapable of understanding the issue, and those who thrive on chaos
and frivolity. That is the price I will pay for speaking up for what
I believe is right. I choose to personally suffer those "slings and
arrows" if it will in any way stem the loss of our right to navigate
the skies.

I can see that you are capable of willing restraint by your decision
to refrain from publicly posting the "funny stories" you mentioned
above. Thank you.

For our own good, I would strongly urge all airmen to emphasize our
sober dedication to responsible airmanship when in view of the public
as we are in this publicly archived forum.




.................................................. ...............

Newsgroups: rec.aviation.piloting
From: (Geoff Peck)
Subject: CHARTER: rec.aviation.piloting
Followup-To: poster
Reply-To:
Message-ID:
Supersedes:
Expires: 20 Feb 2002
Organization: The rec.aviation auto-poster
Distribution: world
Originator:
Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2002 08:45:46 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 192.136.112.1
X-Complaints-To:
X-Trace: sjc-read.news.verio.net 1010911546 192.136.112.1 (Sun, 13
Jan 2002 08:45:46 GMT)
NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2002 08:45:46 GMT


[This message is posted automatically every month.]

The charter of rec.aviation.piloting is:


************************************************** **************************
* Information pertinent to pilots of general aviation aircraft
* which would not fall into one of the other non-misc
* rec.aviation groups. Topics include, but are not limited to
* flying skills, interesting sights, destinations, flight
* characteristics of aircraft, unusual situations, handling
* emergencies, working with air traffic control, international
* flights, customs and immigration, experiences with ground
* support facilities, etc.

************************************************** **************************


================================================== ============================
N.B. articles relevant to wanting to learn to fly, learning
to fly, initially obtaining a medical certificate,
instructional techniques, textbooks, videotapes, written
and flight tests, etc. belong in rec.aviation.student
and not in this group! [rec.aviation.piloting]

================================================== ============================

! Please note that many articles get posted to
! rec.aviation.piloting which should be posted to
! rec.aviation.misc, and vice-versa. For reference, the charter
! of rec.aviation.misc is:
!
! In case there are things which didn't get "caught" by the
! other groups, rec.aviation.misc provides a home for these
! other topics. An example would be posts on commercial
! airliners and ultralights which, for the moment, do not have
! their own home.

There are now many separate subgroups on rec.aviation; if the
charter above doesn't match the content of the article you're
posting (or you're following up), please consider one of the other
groups as a more appropriate forum:

rec.aviation.aerobatics Aerobatics and unusual attitude
flying
* rec.aviation.announce Events of interest to the aviation
community
* rec.aviation.answers Frequently asked questions about
aviation
rec.aviation.hang-gliding Hang-gliding, paragliding,
foot-launched flight
rec.aviation.homebuilt Selecting, designing, building, and
restoring aircraft
rec.aviation.ifr Flying under Instrument Flight Rules
rec.aviation.marketplace Aviation classifieds
rec.aviation.military Military aircraft of the past,
present and future
rec.aviation.military.naval Discussion of Naval Aviation
subjects
rec.aviation.misc Miscellaneous topics in aviation
rec.aviation.owning Information on owning airplanes
rec.aviation.piloting General discussion for aviators
rec.aviation.products Reviews and discussion of products
for pilots
rec.aviation.restoration Forum for debate on aircraft
restoration
rec.aviation.rotorcraft Helicopters and other rotary wing
aircraft
rec.aviation.simulators Flight simulation on all levels
rec.aviation.soaring All aspects of sailplanes and
hang-gliders
* rec.aviation.stories Anecdotes of flight experiences
rec.aviation.student Learning to fly
rec.aviation.ultralight Light aircraft in general, all
topics
rec.aviation.balloon Hot air and gas balloons and
airships
rec.aviation.powerchutes Safety and operation of powered
parachutes

[newsgroups marked by * are moderated groups]

A common question is "what should I do if an article spans the
charters of two or more groups?" The answer is cross-posting. If
you have an article which clearly crosses the boundaries of
several groups, you should post a **single** copy of the article
to **all** of the relevant groups. Don't post separate copies to
each group. Most modern newsreaders will display the article
exactly once to the reader -- in the first group in which it is
encountered and read.

If you feel that the replies should be directed to a subset of the
groups to which you are submitting your post, be sure to include a
line of the form "Followup-to: groupname" in the header of your
message. See the header of this message for an example.

If you are replying to a cross-posted article and your reply is
germane to only a subset of the original groups, please ensure
that you check the Newsgroups: line to remove unnecessary groups.
If the reply is germane to all the groups in which the article was
originally posted, try to ensure that all the groups are listed in
the Newsgroups: line. Some older newsreaders cause a reply to go
only to the group which is currently being read.

Use cross-posting sparingly. If an article "90% belongs" in one
group and "10% belongs" in another, post it only to the first
group.

Geoff

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 14:51:29 GMT, Larry Dighera
wrote:

Perhaps it's time to charter a new newsgroup:
rec.aviation.hangar-flying. ...

What you really want is one of two things:

1. Get used to newsgroup culture. It's the
new Wild West, a frontier without
limits.

2. A moderated newsgroup, e.g.,
rec.aviation.humorless.piloting.moderated

We could post a Request For Discussion in
the rec.aviation.* hierarchy.

RFDs are circulated and debated through
news:news.groups. These are the people
who brought you rec.aviation.piloting and
all of the rec.aviation.* groups. There are rules and
regulations for creating new groups. If you're serious
about starting a new group, I'd be happy to help you
understand the technicalities. If you're not serious,
then you're joking, and that is contrary to the charter
of r.a.p. per your interpretation. :-P

(Rev.) Martin X. Moleski, SJ, Ph.D.
A moderator of news:rec.autos.sport.nascar.moderated
Lurker in r.a.p.

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 12:41:17 -0500, "Martin X. Moleski, SJ"
wrote in Message-Id:
:

On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 14:51:29 GMT, Larry Dighera
wrote:

Perhaps it's time to charter a new newsgroup:
rec.aviation.hangar-flying. ...

What you really want is one of two things:

1. Get used to newsgroup culture. It's the
new Wild West, a frontier without
limits.

I've been posting to usenet since 1984. Believe me, I'm quite used to
its culture. What makes you think I'm not?

2. A moderated newsgroup, e.g.,
rec.aviation.humorless.piloting.moderated

I doubt there would be significant traffic to warrant such a group.
In any event, I do not condone the censorship (be it through
moderation, or other means) of others' rights to free expression of
their thoughts on usenet.

We could post a Request For Discussion in the rec.aviation.* hierarchy.

RFDs are circulated and debated through news:news.groups.

Right. And how are the people who would be interested in such a
discussion notified that it is taking place in
news.announce.newgroups?

From the FAQ:

A request for discussion on creation of a new newsgroup should be
posted to news.announce.newgroups, news.groups, and any other
groups or mailing lists at all related to the proposed topic if
desired. news.announce.newgroups is moderated, and the
Followup-to: header will be set so that the actual discussion
takes place only in news.groups.

My suggestion seems consistent with the FAQ.

These are the people
who brought you rec.aviation.piloting and
all of the rec.aviation.* groups. There are rules and
regulations for creating new groups.

Yep: http://www.faqs.org/faqs/usenet/crea...sgroups/part1/

If you're serious
about starting a new group, I'd be happy to help you
understand the technicalities.

Your kind offer is most appreciated. However, I have no difficulty in
understanding the technicalities, thanks.

If you're not serious,
then you're joking, and that is contrary to the charter

If the creation of a hangar-flying newsgroup will divert those who
post frivolity and inanities in the piloting newsgroup to the new one,
I'm serious.

("Larry Dighera" wrote lots of stuff)

Sorry folks, I'm going line by line - sort of.

Larry. I'm going to take a whack at this even though it's 4am. This will be
"stream of consciousness" stuff, so hold on.


The charter of rec.aviation.piloting is:


Topics include, but are not limited to......


Perhaps it's time to charter a new newsgroup:


This newsgroup is fine the way it is. There's 500 rec.aviation groups now,
you need another?


I see the intended content of rec.aviation.piloting more as an
informational resource and news exchange medium among responsible
airmen, than a hee-haw party line despite the fact that many would
prefer to reduce it to that. The choice is ours.


This is a GREAT place to hang out and talk aviation talk - pull up a bale of
hay Mr. Douglas, don't let Mr. Ziffel's pig bother you.

Yes, less political talk lately has been a relief. Less headset talk would
be nice too, but there are those who live for those threads g. I have a
big button on my toolbar - Mark Conversation as Read. When a thread is not
of interest to me, I hit that button. If a thread gets out of control, I hit
that button. It's a great button, you should get one.


I was at a banquet Saturday night talking with the guy who organized the
National Air Tour. He mostly flew the Pilatus support plane. Talk about
funny stories - he's got some about the tour. ...but those stories are
not
welcome here no more. :-(

Your self-imposed restraint is noted (despite your double-negative).


It's a play on a Tom Petty song:

Chorus
Don't come around here no more
Don't come around here no more
Whatever you're looking for
Hey, don't come around here no more

Back to the Air Tour. Wow, is all I can say. You don't want stories from the
pilots who flew 4,000 miles on the National air Tour? Larry, they were
putting their planes down in bean fields, and then flying to the next town
....out of the bean fields. This is in 2003. Type of plane? Oh, just a
Tri-Motor. One guy, in one of the Sikorskys, was "humping" rides at every
stop. They'd land at a town - most of the pilots would want to hit the hotel
right away, but this guy was giving rides ..."every" stop. He'd then have to
catch a cab back to the hotel, later that night, because he'd missed the
bus - again.

How bout this one - on the day they were to fly the final leg, back to
Willow Run, there was a thunderstorm in their path. It was the only T-storm
in the entire country that day. Also, Ford was holding open a narrow time
slot for the planes, at their Proving Grounds track (the site of the
original Ford Airport). Weather meant the National Air Tour planes couldn't
get over there on time - so they called Ford and said it won't work out -
doing a touch-n-go at the original starting line with all of the planes.
Weather broke a few hours later. Tour called Ford back and asked if the
Proving Grounds track people could all take their lunch break ...now. Ford
said sure, you've got 20 minutes. Tour organizers loaded up all the
Tri-Motors with Tour pilots. They crammed as many people (Tour pilots and
crew) as they could into about 4 planes and headed over to do some low
passes, and a few touch-n-go nods to the past National Air Tours of the 20's
and 30's.

He had a bunch of these stories, some funny, some almost unprintable. g


Perhaps the substance of the "guys" talk would be a more appropriate
subject for you to share with us in this PUBLIC forum.

"Guy's"

Your word "substance" seems to imply stripped of any ...flavor, charm, or
personality - mine, or the personality of the original guy telling the
stories. Larry, these were funny stories, whimsical stories, romantic
stories, adventurous stories, but not too many were bland and
(appropriately) informative stories.

I'm certainly no writer, but at least my stuff doesn't read like the FAR's.
Not saying yours does, but you seem to want this newsgroup to resemble
(excruciatingly dull) city council proceedings. Just my observation.


This isn't a PhD dissertation newsgroup, it's a hangar flying newsgroup.

What you overlook is the PUBLIC nature of usenet in general (which is
publicly archived for posterity), and specifically the image of pilots
the lay public carries away from reading rec.aviation.piloting.
Again, the choice is ours.


This is where you head to the deep end of the pool. History will judge this
group to be: civil (lack of swearing in the posts is a big +) informative,
entertaining, interesting, and (I think) welcoming to new posters. It's also
peopled by posters passionate about planes.


In this time, when GA is being singled out as an expendable "kick dog"
by those bureaucracies in charge of national security, the military,
and airlines, ..., I believe it is in the best interest of all airmen
to put forth to the public our best face, our sober dedication to
responsibility and professionalism, rather than portray ourselves the
as frivolous clowns recklessly cavorting over the heads of the
ground-bound public as the media continually attempt.


Hmm. You've got professional, bureaucrat, sober, and responsible all in one
sentence.


Perhaps we should all consider how what we're about to post reflects
on our fellows. My fear is, that if we fail to police ourselves,
restrictive measures will be arbitrarily imposed upon us by those with
the power to advance their own agenda. Please, let's don't give them
any ammunition here.


Neal has a funny looking plane. (When around Neal, it's best to call it
unique) Have you seen it? It's so odd it's actually kind of cool.
CheckerBird.

http://www.nealhoward.net/

The plane is a Cherokee 140. Oh my God Larry. Indian names!!! Look out, here
come the public, I mean villagers with their torches.


I realize that my views will likely be ridiculed by those who are
incapable of understanding the issue, and those who thrive on chaos
and frivolity. That is the price I will pay for speaking up for what
I believe is right. I choose to personally suffer those "slings and
arrows" if it will in any way stem the loss of our right to navigate
the skies.


There's a Psyche studies Masters Research Thesis that can be written just on
the above paragraph.

Larry, there is no issue. Some might be incapable of understanding *you*,
but other than that - no issue. Politics and religion posts are down, that's
a good thing. Other than that - no issue.


I can see that you are capable of willing restraint by your decision
to refrain from publicly posting the "funny stories" you mentioned
above. Thank you.


You're welcome. Now, how about dinner at my house? We can eat bread ...the
kind with no crusts. Nothing else, just bread ...and water.


For our own good, I would strongly urge all airmen to emphasize our
sober dedication to responsible airmanship when in view of the public
as we are in this publicly archived forum.


Again with the sober. I think you're baiting me now. :-)

I can't tell if you're paranoid or simply have issues with some kind of
pompously self-important pilot ego thing.

Rereading this a few times now, it dawns on me what's at the core of your
"issues." Larry, you're one of those people who thrive in a bureaucracy.
You're smart, but you've given up "common sense" to the rulebook. The rule
book is safe and comforting.

Kobayashi Maru my friend. Kobayashi Maru.

--
Montblack

I come here because all my other friends are bored with me
talking about aeroplanes. Even the pilot friends! :-)

Paul

If you can toast the bread and put some butter on it, it'll do me.

"Montblack" wrote in message
news:3fa23c4d$0$75893 This is a GREAT place to hang out and talk aviation
talk - pull up a bale of
hay Mr. Douglas, don't let Mr. Ziffel's pig bother you.

You're welcome. Now, how about dinner at my house? We can eat bread ...the
kind with no crusts. Nothing else, just bread ...and water.

I come here because all my other friends are bored with me
talking about aeroplanes. Even the pilot friends! :-)

Heh -- I hear that.

Actually, I think that's the best part about owning the inn, Paul -- I've
always got new people to torture! :-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

My ex-lodger (he didn't leave because of this, he left
because he lost his job from the telecomms downturn)
was a pilot (lapsed) and aviation nut. I could even overdose
him with Discovery Wings and Pilot/Flyer/Today's Pilot
magazines, etc...

Now he's moved out, he does seem to come to more
aviation events than he used to though! Must be missing all
the aviation stuff... :-)

Paul

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:wwOpb.103450$Fm2.88658@attbi_s04...
Actually, I think that's the best part about owning the inn, Paul -- I've
always got new people to torture! :-)

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message news:wwOpb.103450$Fm2.88658@attbi_s04...
I come here because all my other friends are bored with me
talking about aeroplanes. Even the pilot friends! :-)

Heh -- I hear that.

Actually, I think that's the best part about owning the inn, Paul -- I've
always got new people to torture! :-)

And they pay for the privilege!

John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)