Logging time as safety pilot?

BTIZ wrote:

some will state, that if it is a complex aircraft, you need the complex
endorsement, same for high performance, or tail dragger

Those that do are wrong. You need to be rated in category and class; that's all.
You only need the endorsements to act as PIC.

George Patterson
Love, n.: A form of temporary insanity afflicting the young. It is curable
either by marriage or by removal of the afflicted from the circumstances
under which he incurred the condition. It is sometimes fatal, but more
often to the physician than to the patient.

agreed.. but thrown out there for further discussion..

I wonder what the FAQ file for Part 61 says... mmmm

BT

"Ron Rosenfeld" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 31 Jan 2004 18:39:42 -0800, "BTIZ"
wrote:

some will state, that if it is a complex aircraft, you need the complex
endorsement, same for high performance, or tail dragger

And for acting as safety pilot, those who so state would be wrong.
Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

On Sun, 1 Feb 2004 09:33:19 -0800, "BTIZ" wrote:

I wonder what the FAQ file for Part 61 says... mmmm


Are you talking about the FAQ's before or after Pinkston's initial
interpretation was corrected?


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

Revision 19, John D Lynch:

QUESTION: According to § 91.109(b), a safety pilot must possess at least a
private certificate with appropriate category & class ratings. Is it
necessary for that safety pilot to be "current" in the aircraft (landings,
etc.)? Requirements of 61.55 specifically exempt safety pilots [§
61.55(d)(4)], but where are the safety pilot criteria actually spelled out.
§ 61.57 refers to pilot-in-command requirements, but a safety pilot is not
PIC, only a required crew member. Further, has there ever been an
interpretation that the safety pilot must be Instrument Rated for that type
of VFR operation?

ANSWER: Ref. § 61.31(d)(1); § 61.51(e)(1)(iii), § 61.51(f)(2), § 61.3(c); §
61.56(c), § 61.57(c); A safety pilot is a "required crewmember" and must
hold at least a valid private pilot certificate with category and class
ratings appropriate to the aircraft being flown per § 91.109(b) and a valid
medical certificate per § 61.3(c). A valid pilot certificate is one which
has not been revoked or under suspension.

That person who is serving as a safety pilot may choose to act as the legal
pilot-in-command (per 14 CFR part 1) and log the time as PIC [per §
61.51(e)(1)(iii)], or otherwise log the time as SIC time [per §
61.51(f)(2)], but is not even required to log the time at all. However, the
safety pilot's name must be logged by the person practicing instrument
flight [per § 61.51(g)(3)(ii)]. If the safety pilot is going to act as the
legal PIC for the flight that person must ". . . Hold the appropriate
category, class, and type rating (if a class rating and type rating are
required) for the aircraft to be flown;" [per § 61.31(d)(1)]. ). And if the
flight is conducted in a high performance, complex, tail wheel, etc.
aircraft and the safety pilot is acting as the legal PIC that pilot must
have the appropriate endorsements that are required by § 61.31(e), (f)
and/or (i), as appropriate. This could be a reason why a safety pilot might
only be able to serve as an SIC and log it as SIC time.



"Ron Rosenfeld" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 1 Feb 2004 09:33:19 -0800, "BTIZ"
wrote:

I wonder what the FAQ file for Part 61 says... mmmm


Are you talking about the FAQ's before or after Pinkston's initial
interpretation was corrected?


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

On Sun, 1 Feb 2004 21:16:18 -0800, "BTIZ" wrote:

And if the
flight is conducted in a high performance, complex, tail wheel, etc.
aircraft and the safety pilot is acting as the legal PIC

Yes but that answer specifically refers only to the safety pilot acting as
*PIC*.

It does NOT refer to the safety pilot acting as a safety pilot (or logging
SIC time).


Ron (EPM) (N5843Q, Mooney M20E) (CP, ASEL, ASES, IA)

(from the FAQ) "And if the
flight is conducted in a high performance, complex, tail wheel, etc.
aircraft and the safety pilot is acting as the legal PIC that pilot must
have the appropriate endorsements that are required by § 61.31(e), (f)
and/or (i), as appropriate. This could be a reason why a safety pilot might
only be able to serve as an SIC and log it as SIC time."

Yes but that answer specifically refers only to the safety pilot acting as
*PIC*. It does NOT refer to the safety pilot acting as a safety pilot (or
logging
SIC time).


I would take that omission to mean that to act as safety pilot and not PIC one
does not need those endorsements.

Jose

--
(for Email, make the obvious changes in my address)

On Sun, 01 Feb 2004 02:31:21 GMT, "CFLav8r"
wrote:

I recently helped a friend fly to St. Augustine from Orlando.
My question is: Can or should you log the time as safety pilot?
Although I did not actually fly the aircraft, I did handle the radios and
visual guide while my friend flew under the hood.

David (KORL)


the phase of your flying life where logging of time is so important is
when you are accumulating the hours for a higher rating.

if you showed up for an interview with the bulk of your hours toward
the rating as safety pilot time do you think that anyone would take it
seriously?

log the important hours, not the useless stuff.

just be happy in the thought that one of your mates thought enough of
you to invite you along. you might need the same assistance at the
other end of your flying life yourself.

Stealth ( I log tacho time ) Pilot
oz.

the phase of your flying life where logging of time is so important is
when you are accumulating the hours for a higher rating.

The phase of my life is over forty and not interested in a flying career.
I am merely trying to find out what colum to mark the times in.
I am quite aware of what hours I need for my instrument rating that I am
working on
and fully aware that no part of safety pilot will that count towards that.

if you showed up for an interview with the bulk of your hours toward
the rating as safety pilot time do you think that anyone would take it
seriously?

I'm not applying for any jobs.

log the important hours, not the useless stuff.

I try to log every minute in the air as a so-called journal the way Richard
L Collins
has suggested as a great way of keeping track of where you have been
and how you got there. Its in one of his videos from Sportys.

just be happy in the thought that one of your mates thought enough of
you to invite you along. you might need the same assistance at the
other end of your flying life yourself.

My friend could not have made that flight if it wasn't for me.
His other option was to take an instructor with him that would charge
him for his time.
But you are partially right about one thing, I will invite him along whether
I need
his assistance or not.
Because as a pilot I know most of us will use any excuse to fly.
If I were asked to come along on a flight to pickup Brillo pads and we were
flying there, I would always say yes as most of us that love to fly would.

Stealth ( I log tacho time ) Pilot
oz.


David (KORL)

"BTIZ" wrote in message news:KFZSb.2742$IF1.246@fed1read01...

but to act as safety pilot for someone under the hood.. you have to hold at
least a private pilot certificate and be qualified to fly the aircraft

Nope, you just need to be rated in category and class (presuming the aircraft
doesn't need a type rating).

some will state, that if it is a complex aircraft, you need the complex
endorsement, same for high performance, or tail dragger

That is only required if you are going to be pilot in command.

A safety pilot is not necessarily pilot in command.

A guy helping in an aircraft or operation only requiring one pilot is
called a passenger.

"Dave S" wrote in message nk.net...
Keep in mind.. if the airplane goes somewhere
it shouldnt, or something happens the PIC is likely to be held
accountable.. so a little bit of trust is in order.


In practice, all pilots aboard are going to be held accountable. The
enforcement action will follow the one most likely to be harmed by the
action rather than any sense of responsibility. The FAA is not interested
in justice nor safety.