Another Cirrus BRS deployment:

When was the last time you ever hit more than two green lights in a row?

I don't know how common this is in other places, but when I learned to drive
in downtown Des Moines, Iowa, where the speed limit is the standard 20 miles
per hour business district limit, you can go through all of downtown
(guessing 6 to 10 lights) with a green light, by going exactly 18 miles per
hour. I always thought it was pretty cool, and pretty funny how people that
didn't know about this would accelerate as hard as they could at each green
light, go well over the speed limit, only to get to a red light at the next
intersection and lose all their efforts at going faster by waiting at the
light. They made their own stop and go traffic instead of riding the green
light "wave"...

-Aviv Hod

"Tom Sixkiller" wrote
Serious accident rates (IB) are down...minor accident rates are up.

What's the difference between serious and minor? Serious accidents
are those that result in fatalities and hospitalizations; minor
accidents only cause property damage. Lots of accidents that would
have been serious 50 years ago are now minor, because 50 years ago
frames were rigid and transmitted impact directly to the occupants,
seat belts were rarely used, and airbags didn't exist. Getting
impaled on a steering column in a low speed collision was common.
Quite often, accidents were fatal yet the cars were repaired and back
on the road in days.

These days, nobody will design a steering system that will impale you
on the column, seat belt use is common, airbags are near-universal,
crumple zones are the norm, and in general the car is dramatically
safer. These days if you are killed in an accident, you can be
certain nobody will ever drive your car again. Having the car
totalled with no injuries to the occupants is more the norm than the
exception.

Other improvements have been made as well. Today's cars handle
dramatically better, which should allow people to steer around
accidents, stay on the road in wetter conditions, etc. Brake systems
are dramatically more effective and reliable. Drunk driving laws have
grown teeth. We should be having fewer accidents. We're not. People
simply drive more agressively. They follow closer, drive faster in
worse weather, stay at the party later and drive home fatigued (but
legally sober), and in every possible way circumvent all the safety
regulations. The only things that work to improve safety are measures
that make the accident more survivable.

As well as several others factors outside of technology. Technology should
make them _cheaper_.

Only if they had the same capability. All the mandated safety
improvements have inevitably raised the costs. The crumple zones
haven't helped - not only do they cost money to put in, but they cause
expensive damage in even low-speed collisions. Collision insurance
rates are up in real dollars.

Michael

Tom

Come to Houston. New Mayor just synchronized part of the down town
lights and is working on the rest and he's even a Democrat )

Our new Tooter Ville Trolley, running down main street, is still
hitting cars. Has had around 35 accidents since start of business
early in year (just before Super Bowel) (

Big John

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 21:35:50 -0700, "Tom Sixkiller"
wrote:

----clip----

Michael,

Actually, that's not true at all. FATALITY rates have improved
dramatically; accident rates are actually up.


Huh? You're saying there are more fatalities per miles driven, persons
transported, cars in the system or whatever other meaningful rate you
like to chose? It ain't so.

--
Thomas Borchert (EDDH)

Thomas Borchert wrote
Actually, that's not true at all. FATALITY rates have improved
dramatically; accident rates are actually up.

Huh? You're saying there are more fatalities per miles driven, persons
transported, cars in the system or whatever other meaningful rate you
like to chose? It ain't so.

It ain't so, and it's not what I'm saying at all. Fatalities are down
by any meaningful measure (of course total fatalities are up, but
that's just because there are so many more cars and drivers on the
road). Accident rates are up. Collision insurance rates are up in
real dollars. We're having more accidents than ever, but a far
smaller fraction of them are fatal.

Reasons? Seat belts, air bags, crumple zones, impact-attenuating
crash barriers, etc. Those things work, because they don't do
anything to prevent accidents but simply make them more survivable.
Insurance companies won't give you a break for ABS anymore - they've
discovered that drivers who have ABS and know it simply drive more
agressively.

Michael

On Mon, 12 Apr 2004 at 19:53:19 in message
, Thomas Borchert
wrote:

Both car and GA accident rates have dramatically declined with technical
improvements to safety over the last decades. This expert is simply not supported
by the numbers.

I was convinced that that was the main effect until I read a book called
'Risk' by John Adams. Now I do believe in risk compensation and the
possibility, for example that better and safer cars may lead to more
accidents to pedestrians.

The biggest factor for cars appears to be that the more traffic there
is, then the more the accident rate falls.

In the UK the highest annual road fatalities were in 1926. From then a
steady decline took place until the last couple of years. The only
exception to that was the war years when exceptional factors sent
accidents through the roof. (Example: complete darkness everywhere at
night and vehicles with almost non-existent head lights.)
--
David CL Francis