An Olive Branch

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Martin Hotze" wrote in message
...

If it were not for the
electoral college the U.S. would be governed by the residents of large
cities and the rural population (who tend to be more conservative) would
have no say in the law-making process.


that's dictatorship of the majority.


Democracy is a dictatorship by the majority.


Well, no, it isn't supposed to be, because in order to work, a part of the
definition of democracy says:
"the representatives that hold the decision power are moderated by a
constitution that emphasizes protecting individual liberties and the rights
of minorities in society, such as freedom of speech and assembly, freedom of
religion, the right to private property and privacy, as well as equality
before the law and due process under the rule of law, and many more."
:unquote.

This was called "liberal democracy"... The USA is listed as having a
"somewhat" liberal democracy ... maybe it is becoming out of fashion, but I
digress.


An interesting perspective on post-vote democracy comes from
http://democracy2.blogspot.com/
titled "A Tip to the Politically Defeated: Democracy Doesn't End on Election
Day"

Even if you don't wade through the whole thing, the following paragraphs are
interesting:

quote:
Going from local political activity to the global, we are now also
witnessing the growth of a movement some are calling the Second Superpower.
No matter what you think of America's superpower position, there's no
question that many in the world see American hegemony as, at best, a
point-of-view that requires some counteracting or rebuttal, or at worst, a
cancer that requires strong opposition. This new global public power base,
as it were, may hope to achieve what no other nation in the world could
imagine achieving—that is, providing the same degree of political
counterbalance that was “enjoyed” during the Cold War. For better or worse,
anti-U.S. political power is growing, and this power will indeed be exerted
against any U.S. policies deemed to be too extreme.

World citizens didn't vote in the 2004 U.S. election, but don't think for a
minute that this prevents them from influencing U.S. politics in a major
way. Denouncing this new “outside influence” will do nothing to diminish it

:unquote.

Peter Duniho wrote:

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:aItid.296104$wV.217316@attbi_s54...
I'm a "conservative" and mostly "Republican" -- but I'm no church-goer,
and I don't see any evidence of the "Religious Right" in the Republican
Party

The facts are not on your side. The Republican party has made a huge effort
to woo the "religious right", especially over the last two decades. There's
a reason that the strong push to encourage evangelical Christians to come
out and vote was backed by the Republican party. Exit polls from this
election (and any other recent elections) clearly show a strong correlation
between degree of religious conviction and voting Republican.

[...]
Are there religious people in the Republican Party? Sure! And there's a
whole bunch of 'em in the Democratic Party, too.

A true statement. But one that ignores who the evangelicals and
fundamentalists generally vote for. Not all people who consider themselves
"religious" actually share the same beliefs, but there is definitely one
core group of people who consider themselves "religious" that the
Republicans go out of their way to appeal to. And, contrary to the supposed
"conservative" nature of the Republican party, that core group would very
much have all of their religious tenets codified into law.

Oh please. The Democrats have been working hard to woo the Religous Left vote
for decades. More recently, how many did Kerry attend protestant church
services in very liberal areas and/or predominantly black churches? "If it's
Sunday, it's Kerry in the AME." Or Kerry expounding on the important lessons of
St Paul and James or preaching about the Good Samaritan and God's high calling
to an Ohio Congregation, or talking about how you reach the kingdom of Heaven.
Was that part of Kerry's own (Catholic) faith, or was he using to church to
pander for votes, or what? The cheerleading Boston Globe even ran stories about
Kerry (re)discovering his Jewish roots---Jews in the US tend to vote Democrat.
Kerry claim to base his policy on his religous beliefs, including his political
objections to the death penalty.

"Through many dangers, toils and snares I have already come. . . Tis grace that
brought me safe thus far, and grace will lead me home." - John Kerry speaking at
Mt. Olivet Baptist Church in Ohio.

"My faith affects everything that I do, in truth" - John Kerry in the
Presidential Debate (Tempe, AZ)

-=-Alexis

"Alexis Carlson" wrote in message
...
Oh please. The Democrats have been working hard to woo the
Religous Left vote for decades.

So what? First, they haven't done a very effective job (or the "religious
left" is very tiny), since those who state a religious preference of any
sort of Christianity are strongly in the Bush camp (again based on
polls...I'm not interested in any more crap about "well the polls are
wrong"...they are almost always quite close to the truth).

But regardless of what the Democrats have tried, the fact remains that the
Republicans continue to enjoy strong support from the evangelicals and
fundamentalists.

So, did you have a point, or what?

Pete

You do understand that bottom posting after several dozen quoted lines gets you
first-class into the dumper, don't you?

Jim



Alexis Carlson
shared these priceless pearls of wisdom:

-Peter Duniho wrote:
-
- "Jay Honeck" wrote in message
- news:aItid.296104$wV.217316@attbi_s54...
- I'm a "conservative" and mostly "Republican" -- but I'm no church-goer,
- and I don't see any evidence of the "Religious Right" in the Republican
- Party


Jim Weir (A&P/IA, CFI, & other good alphabet soup)
VP Eng RST Pres. Cyberchapter EAA Tech. Counselor
http://www.rst-engr.com

Ah,,, and a little child shall lead them........

"Cub Driver"

That IS an engine that's in front of that thing and not from a weed wacker
or power tool, right? GRIN

--
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=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL-IA
Student - CP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

That would still make us a republic. A democracy would mean we did
not have elected representatives (such as the president) and each
issue would be decided by popular vote.


THAT's what I was saying,,,, we are clearly a republic,,,,, placement
directly by the people would be a democracy

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--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL-IA
Student - CP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -
"SR" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 03 Nov 2004 17:18:35 GMT, "Cecil Chapman"
wrote:
is determined by the members of the electoral
college, not by popular vote (which would make us a democracy).

Unless you know something most if us don't, they did not leave a definitive
reason why the electoral vote system was put in place. There are a a few
reasons it could have been done

Read, Thomas Jefferson and I think one of the reasons will become clear.

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--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL-IA
Student - CP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

Jefferson would have been a staunch libertarian

Read his opinions regarding the potential electorate of the people/comman
man,,,, VERY interesting.

I would guess that he was probably right about the people of his time
(education level - rather lack thereof among the 'common folk').

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--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL-IA
Student - CP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

Ya know! That's a good point,,, an assassin would NEVER lie with his/her
signature on an oath of allegiance just to get closer to the president. JAY
do you read what you write,,,,, are you saying that some idiot who wanted to
get close to the president to do him harm wouldn't LIE on the allegiance
'form'? That's probably why criminals 'never' rob people on Christmas,
they wouldn't want to rob people on a Christian holiday, because it would be
wrong..... (of course, I'm being facetious here, Jay).
--
--
=-----
Good Flights!

Cecil
PP-ASEL-IA
Student - CP-ASEL

Check out my personal flying adventures from my first flight to the
checkride AND the continuing adventures beyond!
Complete with pictures and text at: www.bayareapilot.com

"I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery -

"We who fly, do so for the love of flying. We are alive in the air with
this miracle that lies in our hands and beneath our feet"
- Cecil Day Lewis -

I should also mention again that Bush's brother was diagnosed as being
dyslexic and dyslexia does run in families.


OK, all the dyslexic fighter pilots here, raise your hands.

--
Wm. Donald (Don) Tabor Jr., DDS
PP-ASEL
Chesapeake, VA - CPK, PVG