Newbie Qs on stalls and spins

"Gary Drescher" wrote in message ...

Are there Cherokees that permit intentional spins? The Arrow and Warrior
POHs prohibit them.


Yes. It depends on the year and equipment configuration. Most
-140s are approved for intentional spins in the Utility category.
Many early body (pre '73) Cherokee -180s were also approved for
intentional spins in the Utility category. In '73 the -180 fuselage
was stretched 5 inches, which moved the C.G. back and intentional
spins were no longer approved. The Archer and Warrior both use the
longer fuselage and are not approved.

Note : There are some exceptions for -140 and -180 models equipped
with the large fresh air blower in the tail. You should check the
paperwork and placards on an individual airplane to determine if it is
approved. Also, the PA28 is very sensitive to C.G. in a spin. W&B
MUST be in the Utility category.

John Galban=====N4BQ (PA28-180)

(John Galban) wrote in message . com...
"Gary Drescher" wrote in message ...

Are there Cherokees that permit intentional spins? The Arrow and Warrior
POHs prohibit them.


Yes. It depends on the year and equipment configuration. Most
-140s are approved for intentional spins in the Utility category.

Please have a look at what the FAA officially says about spinning a
Cherokee. Specifically the 140 model.

http://www.faa.gov/certification/air.../ACE-97-02.htm

I took my spin training in a Cherokee 140 and we had a difficult time
keeping it held in a spin, simply letting up a little on the rudder
pedal would exit the spin. We were probably a little too low on the
weight and forward on the CG to get a clearly defined spin going, and
neither I nor my instructor had the balls to want to try "aggravating"
the spin with ailerons or added power. Simply letting go of all the
controls and the little plane would straighten up and begin flying
again, but the airspeed does climb quite disturbingly briskly when the
nose is pointed straight down and the wing starts flying again.
Recovering out of the dive frightened me more than the spin itself.
Reading the FAA's SAIB at the URL above, seems to suggest that a 140
can wrap up in a really tight and scary rapid spin, but we were only
able to to get a really mushy, slow spin going. And before anyone
flames me about it, yes we both were wearing chutes and we looked and
felt really dorky wearing the "acro chutes" in a Cherokee. In
retrospect, if something had gone so badly wrong that we would have
needed the chutes, we probably both could not have been able to egress
a tumbling, plummeting Cherokee thru it's single door anyway.