How close would Hawaii have to be...

I was in Phoenix with my kids hockey team the first weekend of October.
First time I had been there since the mid 70's when I was a kid on a
family trip. I can't for the life of me figure out why anybody would live
there even in the winter, much less the hotter months. If you don't golf
you have absolutely nothing to do. Give me Florida and a nice humid 85 on
the beach anytime.

I was with you until you hit that Florida note. Florida is like a hot, wet,
sticky blanket, with large insects.

I can take it for a week in March, though...

Phoenix, on the other hand, is just about the ugliest city I've ever seen.
Dirty, brown, dusty, barren, with lots of street people and wailing sirens.

But, again, I can take it for a week or two in winter!

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay Honeck wrote:

I was in Phoenix with my kids hockey team the first weekend of October.
First time I had been there since the mid 70's when I was a kid on a
family trip. I can't for the life of me figure out why anybody would live
there even in the winter, much less the hotter months. If you don't golf
you have absolutely nothing to do. Give me Florida and a nice humid 85 on
the beach anytime.


I was with you until you hit that Florida note. Florida is like a hot, wet,
sticky blanket, with large insects.

Growing up in Minnesota I know all about flying insects. This is not a
problem along the Florida coasts. But I do pull the Geckos and little
frogs from my folks pool enclosure. I like humidity when I am by the
ocean and Florida is 100% better for the insects than the midwest.

Growing up in Minnesota I know all about flying insects. This is not a
problem along the Florida coasts. But I do pull the Geckos and little
frogs from my folks pool enclosure. I like humidity when I am by the
ocean and Florida is 100% better for the insects than the midwest.

One thing I really, REALLY like about the Midwest is the way the winter
kills off all the bugs.

In Florida this never happens, thus my comment.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:v9Nud.246308$R05.80734@attbi_s53...
I was in Phoenix with my kids hockey team the first weekend of October.
First time I had been there since the mid 70's when I was a kid on a
family trip. I can't for the life of me figure out why anybody would
live there even in the winter, much less the hotter months. If you don't
golf you have absolutely nothing to do. Give me Florida and a nice humid
85 on the beach anytime.

I was with you until you hit that Florida note. Florida is like a hot,
wet, sticky blanket, with large insects.

I can take it for a week in March, though...

Phoenix, on the other hand, is just about the ugliest city I've ever seen.
Dirty, brown, dusty, barren, with lots of street people and wailing
sirens.

But, again, I can take it for a week or two in winter!

;-)
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

Jay,

What else would a desert be but brown, dusty and barren? It's precisely
because people don't appreciate it's natural, rugged beauty that we find
ourselves in a water crunch. People should let the desert be a desert and
stop trying to convert it into some lush paradise which it isn't meant to
be.

As for the dirty part...Phoenix is no worse (and certainly a lot better)
than many major cities around the country.

The homeless situation is directly tied to the weather. Makes sense doesn't
it? If you're gonna be sleeping outside, why not go where it's warm? Been
to Seattle lately? I seems to me that there are just as many homeless (if
not more...) in Seattle and they are a lot more aggressive when it comes to
panhandling. I've never felt threatened by anyone on the streets of
downtown Phoenix...but I've had the bejezus scared out of me a couple of
time in Seattle by people rushing up and getting right in my face for spare
change.

Dunno why you think we have an over abundance of sirens. We certainly don't
hear them much down here in the SE part of the valley. Maybe you just have
overly sensitive ears? :O)

Jay Beckman
PP-ASEL
Chandler, AZ

news:v9Nud.246308$R05.80734@attbi_s53...
I was in Phoenix with my kids hockey team the first weekend of October.
First time I had been there since the mid 70's when I was a kid on a
family trip. I can't for the life of me figure out why anybody would
live there even in the winter, much less the hotter months. If you don't
golf you have absolutely nothing to do.

How could you possibly know what there is to do after only spending a
*weekend* here? What...did you spend 15 minutes thumbing through the
phonebook in your hotel room?

There's a *ton* of stuff to do here! Like any other city, if you know
what you want to do, you can find it pretty easily -- it's not
Timbuktu... all sports, hobbies and other interests and activities are
just as accessible here as they are anywhere else, some moreso; if you
don't already have an idea what you'd like to do, it takes a little time
to find out what there is just by talking to people and hearing about
places to go and things to do. What exactly did you expect to find that
wasn't here?

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
Phoenix, on the other hand, is just about the ugliest city I've ever seen.
Dirty, brown, dusty, barren, with lots of street people and wailing
sirens.

And as for you, Jay Honeck, visit any major city in the nation, and tell
me there aren't some areas that people in the really nice parts of the
city wish didn't exist! Ever been to San Francisco? It has some of the
most gorgeous architecture, beautifully-restored Victorian homes to die
for, many historical landmarks, spectacular views, and other things to
see. But don't kid yourself -- there are some districts in San Francisco
(as in any big city) that are crawling with street people, old battered
homes that are barely hanging by a thread, streets littered with raw
garbage and dirty diapers, and areas where you wouldn't *dare* want to
even THINK about getting out of your car.

Point being that it's easy to make these blanket generalizations about
cities that you only see certain parts of. As Jay Beckman said, Phoenix
is no better or worse than any other big city ... certainly not all of
it is "dirty, brown, dusty, or barren" and God knows, saying there's
"absolutely nothing to do" couldn't be further from the truth. Of
course, if you like building snowmen, being on hurricane watch, trapsing
around in the rain for 6 months out of every year, and being bundled up
in layers and layers of warm clothes, you wouldn't be happy in Phoenix.

wrote in message
...
news:v9Nud.246308$R05.80734@attbi_s53...
I was in Phoenix with my kids hockey team the first weekend of
October.
First time I had been there since the mid 70's when I was a kid on a
family trip. I can't for the life of me figure out why anybody would
live there even in the winter, much less the hotter months. If you
don't
golf you have absolutely nothing to do.

How could you possibly know what there is to do after only spending a
*weekend* here? What...did you spend 15 minutes thumbing through the
phonebook in your hotel room?

There's a *ton* of stuff to do here! Like any other city, if you know
what you want to do, you can find it pretty easily -- it's not
Timbuktu... all sports, hobbies and other interests and activities are
just as accessible here as they are anywhere else, some moreso; if you
don't already have an idea what you'd like to do, it takes a little time
to find out what there is just by talking to people and hearing about
places to go and things to do. What exactly did you expect to find that
wasn't here?

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
Phoenix, on the other hand, is just about the ugliest city I've ever
seen.
Dirty, brown, dusty, barren, with lots of street people and wailing
sirens.

And as for you, Jay Honeck, visit any major city in the nation, and tell
me there aren't some areas that people in the really nice parts of the
city wish didn't exist! Ever been to San Francisco? It has some of the
most gorgeous architecture, beautifully-restored Victorian homes to die
for, many historical landmarks, spectacular views, and other things to
see. But don't kid yourself -- there are some districts in San Francisco
(as in any big city) that are crawling with street people, old battered
homes that are barely hanging by a thread, streets littered with raw
garbage and dirty diapers, and areas where you wouldn't *dare* want to
even THINK about getting out of your car.

Point being that it's easy to make these blanket generalizations about
cities that you only see certain parts of. As Jay Beckman said, Phoenix
is no better or worse than any other big city ... certainly not all of
it is "dirty, brown, dusty, or barren" and God knows, saying there's
"absolutely nothing to do" couldn't be further from the truth. Of
course, if you like building snowmen, being on hurricane watch, trapsing
around in the rain for 6 months out of every year, and being bundled up
in layers and layers of warm clothes, you wouldn't be happy in Phoenix.

The preceding message was brought to you by the Greater Phoenix Convention
and Visitors Bureau... (Hi Shirl...)

Grin, Duck, Run...

Jay B

What else would a desert be but brown, dusty and barren? It's precisely
because people don't appreciate it's natural, rugged beauty that we find
ourselves in a water crunch. People should let the desert be a desert and
stop trying to convert it into some lush paradise which it isn't meant to
be.

Agreed. I find the desert to be starkly beautiful, and love the mountains.
I've always assumed that I would retire to the desert Southwest.

But an interesting thing always happens on our return flights from the
region. My spirits begin to soar as we start to hit "the green belt" -- and
are positively tingling by the time we're winging our way over the
incredibly intense greens of Iowa. There's just something about seeing
colors that is wonderful, and that I really miss when I'm out West.

Now, of course, at this time of year Iowa looks pretty much like the
desert -- brown as far as the eye can see, except for evergreen trees -- and
snow, when it finally gets here.

As for the dirty part...Phoenix is no worse (and certainly a lot better)
than many major cities around the country.

What makes Phoenix (and other desert cities -- it's certainly not a
Phoenix-only problem) so dirty is the lack of rain. During droughts, Iowa
gets the same way. Luckily, we are usually blessed with a nice, cleansing
rain about once a week, all spring/summer/fall long -- which really does
wonders on the streetscapes.

The homeless situation is directly tied to the weather. Makes sense
doesn't it? If you're gonna be sleeping outside, why not go where it's
warm?

Absolutely. I've heard that the entire west coast of southern California is
the same way.

What a shame that the "do-gooders", in an attempt to fix some real problems,
forced the government to disband most of the mental health system, in favor
of "personal choice" and "freedom". How free do we think all those
schizophrenics who are now forced to live on the street really feel?

Been to Seattle lately? I seems to me that there are just as many
homeless (if not more...) in Seattle and they are a lot more aggressive
when it comes to panhandling. I've never felt threatened by anyone on the
streets of downtown Phoenix...but I've had the bejezus scared out of me a
couple of time in Seattle by people rushing up and getting right in my
face for spare change.

Shame on Seattle for not putting an end to that problem.

Dunno why you think we have an over abundance of sirens. We certainly
don't hear them much down here in the SE part of the valley. Maybe you
just have overly sensitive ears? :O)

When you live in an area of the country that has no serious crime, you get
used to sirens being a rarity. Hearing them 24/7 when we last visited
Phoenix was a real downer.
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"

"Jay Honeck" wrote in message
news:IVhvd.494063$wV.348685@attbi_s54...
What else would a desert be but brown, dusty and barren? It's precisely
because people don't appreciate it's natural, rugged beauty that we find
ourselves in a water crunch. People should let the desert be a desert
and stop trying to convert it into some lush paradise which it isn't
meant to be.

Agreed. I find the desert to be starkly beautiful, and love the
mountains. I've always assumed that I would retire to the desert
Southwest.

But an interesting thing always happens on our return flights from the
region. My spirits begin to soar as we start to hit "the green belt" --
and are positively tingling by the time we're winging our way over the
incredibly intense greens of Iowa. There's just something about seeing
colors that is wonderful, and that I really miss when I'm out West.

Oh man, if you want colors, you need to spend more time in the air out here
around sunrise/sunset where you'll see colors you won't believe exist in
nature. Mind blowing.

Believe it or not, I've gotten so used to the muted colors of the desert
that when I visit family in Michigan (in the summer) the abundance of green
is actually kind of hard on the eyes. Looks too much like The Wizard Of Oz
and the Emerald City.

Several of us transplanted mid-westerners also came to the conclusion one
day that the lack of identifiable landmarks on the horizon makes one feel
almost agoraphobic, makes the sky seem "too big" and it's hard to navigate!
We need a mountain to tell direction.

Now, of course, at this time of year Iowa looks pretty much like the
desert -- brown as far as the eye can see, except for evergreen trees --
and snow, when it finally gets here.

Even Antarctica is considered "a desert." ;O)

As for the dirty part...Phoenix is no worse (and certainly a lot better)
than many major cities around the country.

What makes Phoenix (and other desert cities -- it's certainly not a
Phoenix-only problem) so dirty is the lack of rain. During droughts,
Iowa gets the same way. Luckily, we are usually blessed with a nice,
cleansing rain about once a week, all spring/summer/fall long -- which
really does wonders on the streetscapes.

The "rainy season" helps here too, but so does wind. We get so stagnant
during some parts of the year that we develop our infamous "brown cloud"
which is as much desert dust kicked up by agriculture to the west and south
of town as it is auto emissions. Means smooth air for flying, but the viz
sucks.

The homeless situation is directly tied to the weather. Makes sense
doesn't it? If you're gonna be sleeping outside, why not go where it's
warm?

Absolutely. I've heard that the entire west coast of southern California
is the same way.

What a shame that the "do-gooders", in an attempt to fix some real
problems, forced the government to disband most of the mental health
system, in favor of "personal choice" and "freedom". How free do we
think all those schizophrenics who are now forced to live on the street
really feel?

(I tend to basically agree, but I'm not gonna go here...)

Been to Seattle lately? I seems to me that there are just as many
homeless (if not more...) in Seattle and they are a lot more aggressive
when it comes to panhandling. I've never felt threatened by anyone on
the streets of downtown Phoenix...but I've had the bejezus scared out of
me a couple of time in Seattle by people rushing up and getting right in
my face for spare change.

Shame on Seattle for not putting an end to that problem.

Dunno why you think we have an over abundance of sirens. We certainly
don't hear them much down here in the SE part of the valley. Maybe you
just have overly sensitive ears? :O)

When you live in an area of the country that has no serious crime, you get
used to sirens being a rarity. Hearing them 24/7 when we last visited
Phoenix was a real downer.

IIRC, Chandler, AZ is in the top 10 safest places to live and you shouldn't
assume that every siren is a result of crime. Remember how much of an aged
population we have around here. I'd bet dollars to donuts that a lot of
what we hear is EMS helping people and not because somone is being persued
or something is burning.

Jay B.

IIRC, Chandler, AZ is in the top 10 safest places to live and you
shouldn't assume that every siren is a result of crime. Remember how much
of an aged population we have around here. I'd bet dollars to donuts that
a lot of what we hear is EMS helping people and not because somone is
being persued or something is burning.

Good point!

Because Iowa City is so "young" (30K college students in a town of 60K tends
to skew the results), I'll bet we don't have half the ambulance calls
Phoenix has...
--
Jay Honeck
Iowa City, IA
Pathfinder N56993
www.AlexisParkInn.com
"Your Aviation Destination"