A380 unveiling, 1/18/05, Live.

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 17:17:41 GMT, "Frank F. Matthews"
wrote:



AJC wrote:

On Fri, 21 Jan 2005 00:17:11 -0000, "Dave"
wrote:


A friend went to Alaska recently in a 747. He commented that they
could have put that many passengers in a commuter. OTOH when my wife
came back from New Zealand last year, every seat was full. The ones
in front of her had three air sick kids which made it a memorable 13
hours.

The one flight probably didn't pay for the taxi time, but the other
probably did quite well.


No surprise Singapore airlines is the launch customer and that the other
leading customers are all major flyers from Europe to the East. These
flights all tend to be full. I have yet to do a flight where the airplane
has not been chockablock full. They will fill the A380 however many seats
they put in then on these routes.
The major issue will be how quickly the airports will be able to process the
passengers. I would not be surprised to see some immigration duties carried
out on board the aircraft and with the satellite links now available, it is
entirely feasible to link to immigration databases etc. One immigration
officer could happily handle 600 passengers even allowing for the non
straight forward ones over an 10-12 hour period.
Now if an airline offered that service then they would get my business.


This is in contrast with flights from Europe to North America where there is
often empty seats. Last September coming back to London from Chicago the
United flight was half full



This is why so many Americans are so sceptical of the market for the
380. They mostly see small aircraft, empty flights, airlines in
financial problems. Go to airports in Europe, Asia and you see 744s
lined up, and as you say get on the flights and they are packed.
Traffic on the Europe-Asia-Aus/NZ routes is booming, within Europe
there is steady growth, while it is declining on the North Atlantic.
--==++AJC++==--


Actually I haven't seen many small aircraft and no empty flights in the
US for the past several years.

Well I don't see dozens and dozens of US carriers' 747s lined up. Do
you?


not a lack of passengers. Now finding passengers wanting to fly limited
routes so as to fly a 380 that may be a problem.

In the US, yes. In Europe and Asia, certainly not.

--==++AJC++==--

"AJC" wrote in message
news
Well I don't see dozens and dozens of US carriers' 747s lined up. Do
you?

Wonder how a bussines model according to which you run one 747 from the
dessert somewhere from let's say New York to LA once or twice daily the no
frill way (perhaps with a bussines class with a little bit more space and
one dry sandwich) at rock bottom price (ie with a margin similar to what
Ryan Air does) would work out? Wonder what that would do to the market?
Would you - provided you could fill the plane - be able to beat LCC's
carriers that are using 737's on price?

Nik

On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 21:25:17 +0800, "Nik"
wrote:


"AJC" wrote in message
news
Well I don't see dozens and dozens of US carriers' 747s lined up. Do
you?

Wonder how a bussines model according to which you run one 747 from the
dessert somewhere from let's say New York to LA once or twice daily the no
frill way (perhaps with a bussines class with a little bit more space and
one dry sandwich) at rock bottom price (ie with a margin similar to what
Ryan Air does) would work out? Wonder what that would do to the market?
Would you - provided you could fill the plane - be able to beat LCC's
carriers that are using 737's on price?

Nik


You would think it would work on transcontinental flights in the US.
747s operating just one or two frequencies per day between East and
West coast city pairs at rock bottom prices.
--==++AJC++==--

"AJC" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 21:25:17 +0800, "Nik"

You would think it would work on transcontinental flights in the US.
747s operating just one or two frequencies per day between East and
West coast city pairs at rock bottom prices.
--==++AJC++==--

It would depend on there being a constant flow of people who would want to
go from the East to the Vest (and the other way) for whom prize is what
matters most. Who could they be?

Nik

You would think it would work on transcontinental flights in the US.
747s operating just one or two frequencies per day between East and
West coast city pairs at rock bottom prices.

World Airways used to do that JFK-LAX. Didn't last.

If you look at the number of flights on that route, on planes ranging
from 737s and 319s to 767s, at this point you'd have to expect that
everyone else would match your fares and keep you from filling up your
plane, even if they were selling below cost. It's the airline
tradition.

"John R. Levine" wrote:
World Airways used to do that JFK-LAX. Didn't last.

Something big has changed since then. In the 80s and 1990s, Frequent
Flyier loyalty was extreme. But at one point, the price difference
between the low cost carriers and the legacy carriers eroded that
loyalty, allowing people to choose their airline, instead of always
blindly buying from "their" airline.

Once you give up on FF programmes, you're willing to choose the carrier
that offers the best schedukle/plane/service/price/whatever, then a
carrier that offers a cheaper flight from new york to lax would have a
chance now, whereas it stood no chance before.

In article , nobody
wrote:


Something big has changed since then. In the 80s and 1990s, Frequent
Flyier loyalty was extreme. But at one point, the price difference
between the low cost carriers and the legacy carriers eroded that
loyalty, allowing people to choose their airline, instead of always
blindly buying from "their" airline.


I think frequent flyer loyalty was seriously eroded also when the
airlines changed over from having more or less open availability for
award travel, except for certain blackout periods that were stated in
advance, and instead began limiting the number of FF award seats on any
flight to such low levels that cashing in FF miles for award travel
became, if not nearly impossible, at least an almost always unpleasant
and unrewarding hassle.

A couple of particularly unpleasant experiences with that and my FF
loyalty went out the window.

On Sat, 22 Jan 2005 17:47:09 -0800, AES wrote some
stuff about " 380 fuel usage", to which I would like to add the following:

I think frequent flyer loyalty was seriously eroded also when the
airlines changed over from having more or less open availability for
award travel, except for certain blackout periods that were stated in
advance, and instead began limiting the number of FF award seats on any
flight to such low levels that cashing in FF miles for award travel
became, if not nearly impossible, at least an almost always unpleasant
and unrewarding hassle.

That would be "USA based Airlines". Just yesterday I cashed a bunch of miles
for a long flight out of Thailand on Thai Airways. This is for the evening
flight of 12 April. 13 April all the way to 18 April is the main National
Holiday in Thailand (Thai New Year) when the whole country has a holiday.

It's the equivalent of getting an award ticket Los Angeles to Paris on 23 or
24 December.

Cheers,
Chanchao