I'm going to "Laser" a pilot.

Hey Moo, did you ever do that promised laser test? I'm interested in
the results, if any...

As far as actually blinding a pilot (even if temporarily) at a
distance, it is a trivial task... It will take roughly $5K worth of
commercially available industrial equipment and one semester worth of
physics 101 ( a lifetime of brain washing in paranoid superstition and
fanaticism won't cut it)...

Denny

Happy Dog wrote:
Hello FBI surveillance software?

Anyway, I am now in possession of one brand new "Jasper" DPSS 5mw
laser from
bigha.com. That's the same laser used in the recent media hyped
incidents

Is your shift-lock perhaps stuck and you meant to experiment with 5MW?
[]

"Denny" wrote in message
oups.com...
Hey Moo, did you ever do that promised laser test? I'm interested in
the results, if any...


I think he is in the hospital having eye surgery

Hi, i'm new to Alt.lasers, so bear with me, i'm unfamiliar with the
setup of this forum, to be honest i find the google forums hard to
negotiate.I usually hang out at CPF, which was linked to here. Any
way, that getting OT.
What i wanted to bring up, was Skyline i read your email exchange with
the APSA, and was very impressed. Is there any way to include the
Amount of the "reflected" beam that would reflected off the cockpit
widows them selves? If not, Would you be able to include a refrence to
this?

Now i know that you guys have probably seen this:
http://www.lumalaser.com/redbaron.htm many times, but it relates to
this topic entirely. I don't know who's side of the debate it works
best for though

Hi, i'm new to Alt.lasers, so bear with me, i'm unfamiliar w=ADith the
setup of this forum, to be honest i find the google forums h=ADard to
negotiate.I usually hang out at CPF, which was linked to her=ADe. Any
way, that getting OT.
What i wanted to bring up, was Skyline i read your email exc=ADhange
with
the APSA, and was very impressed. Is there any way to includ=ADe the
Amount of the "reflected" beam that would reflected off the=AD cockpit
widows them selves? If not, Would you be able to include a r=ADefrence
to
this?


Now i know that you guys have probably seen this:
http://www.lumalaser.com/redbaron.htm many times, but it relates to
this topic entirely. I don't know who's side of the debate i=ADt works
best for though

"DaFiend" wrote in news:1107310913.876953.310020
@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com:

Hi, i'm new to Alt.lasers, so bear with me, i'm unfamiliar w*ith the
setup of this forum, to be honest i find the google forums h*ard to
negotiate.I usually hang out at CPF, which was linked to her*e. Any
way, that getting OT.
What i wanted to bring up, was Skyline i read your email exc*hange
with the APSA, and was very impressed. Is there any way to includ*e the
Amount of the "reflected" beam that would reflected off the* cockpit
widows them selves? If not, Would you be able to include a r*efrence
to this?

BTW, it's "Skywise".

The genereal rule of thumb for the reflection off uncoated glass
at normal incidence (that is, not at an angle) is 4% per surface.
Not sure what it would be for the material actually used in
aircraft, but I doubt it's much different. It also will change
according to the angle of incidence, namely more reflection.
There could also be a small effect do to polarization. Different
polarizations reflect differently at shallow angles.

Before including such numbers in my calcs, I'd need real world
figures of reflection for the materials in use and their
dimensions and numebr of layers to be of much use.

But then, I'm not sure it would be worth the effort. Perhaps
other optics experts coudl comment?


Now i know that you guys have probably seen this:
http://www.lumalaser.com/redbaron.htm many times, but it relates to
this topic entirely. I don't know who's side of the debate i*t works
best for though

Oh yeah. We've been all over that. Do remember they were
dealing with a slow moving plane at very low altitude.

Brian
--
http://www.skywise711.com - Lasers, Seismology, Astronomy

Home of the Seismic FAQ
http://www.skywise711.com/SeismicFAQ/SeismicFAQ.html

Sed quis custodiet ipsos Custodes?

my apologies, i was in a bit of a hurry.

Not a very good start.

"DaFiend" wrote in news:1107317792.491056.215260
@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com:

my apologies, i was in a bit of a hurry.

Not a very good start.

Don't worry about. No biggy. I hope I helped answer your
question, though.

Brian
--
http://www.skywise711.com - Lasers, Seismology, Astronomy

Home of the Seismic FAQ
http://www.skywise711.com/SeismicFAQ/SeismicFAQ.html

Sed quis custodiet ipsos Custodes?

The convention mentioned (Protocol IV)

I believe you mean, "alluded to," "inferred" or "referenced," because I
did not mention any convention beyond the Geneva Convention.

does not prohibit non-eye-safe lasers on the battlefield.

I've heard that on this forum. I cannot state authoritatively the
reason that my employer told me something different than you are
telling me.

It does prohibit the building of specific
use laser devices to intentionally blind people or use an existing
device to intentionally blind people. It does not cover the
accidental
blinding of personnel as a result of the legitimate use of a laser
device (ie rangefinding or target designation). In any event there
are
only 79 countries that have ratified the protocol (introduced in
1998)
and to date the US is not one of them.

Maybe so, but part of the military's decision not to use non-eye-safe
lasers in battlefield conditions probably involves protecting our own
soldiers. As I understand it, none of our own military personnel are
allowed outside or anywhere they might be exposed to the beam when
using the YAG laser range finder.

"AN/PVS-6, MINI EYESAFE LASER INFRARED"
http://www.globalsecurity.org/milita...d/an-pvs-6.htm

BTW, as it happens, Sam's Laser FAQ includes a description of the unit
I was building. I don't recall ever seeing the final assembly, but I
sure recognize the oscillator sub-assembly.

"Photos of Varo Rangefinder Erbium Laser"
http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/...c/varopics.htm

Please refer to the following photo:

http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/...ic/varo-lh.jpg

Notice the gold-colored section in the foreground with wires leading
out of both ends. My job was to assemble at least ten (10) of those
every day. I built them up on a base block, using a special jig that
appeared to be manufactured out of monel. It consists of two eliptical,
gold-plated reflectors; the Cr:Er:Glass rod (bottom of the elipse, and
about the dimensions of an ink pen refill cartridge); the flashlamp
(top of the elipse, about the size of a pencil); two metal support
arms; two sets of rubber grommets for sealing the rod and flashlamp
into the assembly via the metal support arms.

I had to inspect under a microscope each laser rod that I used. First,
I had to ensure that the ends of the rod had no more than an acceptable
number of inclusions (bright stars in the field of view of the
microscope) and scratches. Then, I had to use several types of solvents
and some lens tissue to clean the ends of the rod. I had to use the
microscope to ensure that my cleaning had been satisfactory. I placed
the rod in a V-shaped holder in the jig. The assembly would be built up
around it.

The grommets were tough to put on the laser rod. They were made of
rubber, which meant that they would contaminate the ends of the rod if
they touched each other. It is difficult to slip a grommet over a tiny
glass rod without allowing the grommet to touch the end of the rod. The
grommets, themselves, had to be cleaned prior to use, too, and might be
slippery from the solvents. I had to wear finger cots and use tweezers
to handle the laser rod and grommets, and I had to change out my finger
cots every 10 or 15 minutes to prevent my skin oils from contaminating
the laser rod.

Our materials suffered from various defects. The laser rods cost about
$800, and most were coated by a third party. My employer tried to coat
some of the rods, using our own optical shop up the hall. The results
were horrible. Under the microscope some of the rods had just a few
"stars." I understood those were coated by the third party. Other rods
looked like a sea of stars. I understood those were rejected rods that
our optical department had tried to salvage.

The flashlamps cost about $50. Our electronics shop brazed the
electrodes, but the results were often a brittle connection. If an
electrode broke off during assembly of the laser cavity, the cavity had
to be dis-assembled and rebuilt with a new flashlamp. This counted
against the 10 units that I had to assemble each day.

I found it expediant to bend the wires of the flashlamps "gently" when
I took them out of the supply bin, so I could eliminate the brittle
connections before I began assembly. My supervisor eventually noticed
that I was rejecting a lot of flashlamps, and told me not to test them
so aggressively. Of course, those wires could snap later during
testing, but that would not be my immediate problem. And, as long as
our units made it to out troops, breakage was not our problem at all.
However, very few of our units actually shipped. Most failed in
environmental testing.

After I finished building each laser cavity on its block, I placed the
unit on a cart. The next team took these units into a dark room, where
the optics were tested and aligned. Somewhere along that time, the
units were taken off the block I had used and were mounted on the plate
that you see in the photograph. I remember seeing the rotating mirror
(the Q-switch) and the circuit board, but that was a few yards farther
down the room from my workstation, so I did not see it very often. Most
of the time, I had my head stuck in the flowhood, "putting little
screws into little holes," as I like to put it.

That's a wonderful description of your assembly and QA procedures.

Could be immortalized in the Laser FAQ.

--- sam | Sci.Electronics.Repair FAQ Mirror: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/
Repair | Main Table of Contents: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/
+Lasers | Sam's Laser FAQ: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/lasersam.htm
| Mirror Sites: http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/REPAIR/F_mirror.html

Note: These links are hopefully temporary until we can sort out the excessive
traffic on Repairfaq.org.

Important: Anything sent to the email address in the message header above is
ignored unless my full name is included in the subject line. Or, you can
contact me via the Feedback Form in the FAQs.

writes:

BTW, as it happens, Sam's Laser FAQ includes a description of the unit
I was building. I don't recall ever seeing the final assembly, but I
sure recognize the oscillator sub-assembly.

"Photos of Varo Rangefinder Erbium Laser"
http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/...c/varopics.htm

Please refer to the following photo:

http://repairfaq.ece.drexel.edu/sam/...ic/varo-lh.jpg

Notice the gold-colored section in the foreground with wires leading
out of both ends. My job was to assemble at least ten (10) of those
every day. I built them up on a base block, using a special jig that
appeared to be manufactured out of monel. It consists of two eliptical,
gold-plated reflectors; the Cr:Er:Glass rod (bottom of the elipse, and
about the dimensions of an ink pen refill cartridge); the flashlamp
(top of the elipse, about the size of a pencil); two metal support
arms; two sets of rubber grommets for sealing the rod and flashlamp
into the assembly via the metal support arms.

I had to inspect under a microscope each laser rod that I used. First,
I had to ensure that the ends of the rod had no more than an acceptable
number of inclusions (bright stars in the field of view of the
microscope) and scratches. Then, I had to use several types of solvents
and some lens tissue to clean the ends of the rod. I had to use the
microscope to ensure that my cleaning had been satisfactory. I placed
the rod in a V-shaped holder in the jig. The assembly would be built up
around it.

The grommets were tough to put on the laser rod. They were made of
rubber, which meant that they would contaminate the ends of the rod if
they touched each other. It is difficult to slip a grommet over a tiny
glass rod without allowing the grommet to touch the end of the rod. The
grommets, themselves, had to be cleaned prior to use, too, and might be
slippery from the solvents. I had to wear finger cots and use tweezers
to handle the laser rod and grommets, and I had to change out my finger
cots every 10 or 15 minutes to prevent my skin oils from contaminating
the laser rod.

Our materials suffered from various defects. The laser rods cost about
$800, and most were coated by a third party. My employer tried to coat
some of the rods, using our own optical shop up the hall. The results
were horrible. Under the microscope some of the rods had just a few
"stars." I understood those were coated by the third party. Other rods
looked like a sea of stars. I understood those were rejected rods that
our optical department had tried to salvage.

The flashlamps cost about $50. Our electronics shop brazed the
electrodes, but the results were often a brittle connection. If an
electrode broke off during assembly of the laser cavity, the cavity had
to be dis-assembled and rebuilt with a new flashlamp. This counted
against the 10 units that I had to assemble each day.

I found it expediant to bend the wires of the flashlamps "gently" when
I took them out of the supply bin, so I could eliminate the brittle
connections before I began assembly. My supervisor eventually noticed
that I was rejecting a lot of flashlamps, and told me not to test them
so aggressively. Of course, those wires could snap later during
testing, but that would not be my immediate problem. And, as long as
our units made it to out troops, breakage was not our problem at all.
However, very few of our units actually shipped. Most failed in
environmental testing.

After I finished building each laser cavity on its block, I placed the
unit on a cart. The next team took these units into a dark room, where
the optics were tested and aligned. Somewhere along that time, the
units were taken off the block I had used and were mounted on the plate
that you see in the photograph. I remember seeing the rotating mirror
(the Q-switch) and the circuit board, but that was a few yards farther
down the room from my workstation, so I did not see it very often. Most
of the time, I had my head stuck in the flowhood, "putting little
screws into little holes," as I like to put it.