Weird Emergencies

"Bart" wrote in message ...
Not an emergency, but def. a really interesting phenomena:

Last night, I was going from Lakeland, FL to Key West. Severe Clear and fairly low winds, so the water in the Gulf was flat
(important for floats to be effective). It was just after dusk when I started following the coast of the everglades, and dark, but
not dark enough to see the stars when I crossed the Gulf on the way to Marathon (the nearest land in the Keys from the bottom of the
'Glades).

Anyways, I had the line of lights on Keys island chain in sight before I started across the open water. The issue was that the
horizon was hazy and fairly obscured, and the line of lights lighting up the Florida Keys made a kind of fake horizon. It was
terribly distracting. I kept having to look inside to correct my conception about where the horizon _really_ was. The lights kept
making my brain think that the horizon was 10 degrees lower than it really was. Very spooky. Once the stars came out full bore the
job was easy again.

Several people had told me cautionary tales about their experiences with "point fixation" over the water, desert, and remote areas,
but I'd never seen the effect before. Its really something to be careful about because the effect is much sronger than you'd ever
believe possible.

Bart

Bart
The same can happen when coming out of a cloud bank and no ground
lights. The stars can give the appearance of being the ground lights
and you are inverted! Of course a skilled pilot will recognize the
situation and not roll over but it sure has happened. Out over water
or jungle, or large areas of desert.....
Fly Safe
Ol Shy & Bashful

"Rocky" wrote in message
om...
"Bart" wrote in message
...
Not an emergency, but def. a really interesting phenomena:

Last night, I was going from Lakeland, FL to Key West. Severe Clear and
fairly low winds, so the water in the Gulf was flat
(important for floats to be effective). It was just after dusk when I
started following the coast of the everglades, and dark, but
not dark enough to see the stars when I crossed the Gulf on the way to
Marathon (the nearest land in the Keys from the bottom of the
'Glades).

Anyways, I had the line of lights on Keys island chain in sight before I
started across the open water. The issue was that the
horizon was hazy and fairly obscured, and the line of lights lighting up
the Florida Keys made a kind of fake horizon. It was
terribly distracting. I kept having to look inside to correct my
conception about where the horizon _really_ was. The lights kept
making my brain think that the horizon was 10 degrees lower than it
really was. Very spooky. Once the stars came out full bore the
job was easy again.

Several people had told me cautionary tales about their experiences with
"point fixation" over the water, desert, and remote areas,
but I'd never seen the effect before. Its really something to be careful
about because the effect is much sronger than you'd ever
believe possible.

Bart

Bart
The same can happen when coming out of a cloud bank and no ground
lights. The stars can give the appearance of being the ground lights
and you are inverted! Of course a skilled pilot will recognize the
situation and not roll over but it sure has happened. Out over water
or jungle, or large areas of desert.....
Fly Safe
Ol Shy & Bashful

Please excuse a little change in the subject. I mention this only because
the subject happened to come up a week or so ago, but, does anyone think
this "might" have played a part in JFK Jr's accident? He was a relatively
new pilot and might have easily succumbed to such a phenomenon.

Just wondering?
Fly Safe,
Steve R.

Steve R. wrote:


job was easy again.

Several people had told me cautionary tales about their experiences with

"point fixation" over the water, desert, and remote areas,

but I'd never seen the effect before. Its really something to be careful

about because the effect is much sronger than you'd ever

believe possible.

Bart

Bart
The same can happen when coming out of a cloud bank and no ground
lights. The stars can give the appearance of being the ground lights
and you are inverted! Of course a skilled pilot will recognize the
situation and not roll over but it sure has happened. Out over water
or jungle, or large areas of desert.....
Fly Safe
Ol Shy & Bashful


Please excuse a little change in the subject. I mention this only because
the subject happened to come up a week or so ago, but, does anyone think
this "might" have played a part in JFK Jr's accident? He was a relatively
new pilot and might have easily succumbed to such a phenomenon.

Just wondering?
Fly Safe,
Steve R.



This has attributed to fatal accidents. Paying too much attention
visual without referencing your instruments in these situations can be
fatal.

rm

I would opine that an indeterminate horizon is where things started to
go pear-shaped with that flight... But I will always wonder how much
part the pax played in the ultimate outcome - in terms of distraction
before and after it started to get away from him.

I will also wonder why he didn't engage at least the wing leveler or HDG
mode of the autopilot (*before* it really got serious of course). Ego?
Lack of A/P training/knowledge?

Dave Blevins

On Fri, 16 Apr 2004 20:45:18 GMT, "Steve R."
wrote:



Please excuse a little change in the subject. I mention this only because
the subject happened to come up a week or so ago, but, does anyone think
this "might" have played a part in JFK Jr's accident? He was a relatively
new pilot and might have easily succumbed to such a phenomenon.

Just wondering?
Fly Safe,
Steve R.

Black hole effect, is I think what this is called. A light way out in the
distance, dark ground before and many have flown into the ground do to this
effect.