Bell 47 goes down in Muncie, IN

Neb,

You are a poster boy for "Bad Netiquette". Not only are you an idiot
and don't understand what you are talking about, but you are damn rude
as well.

You wrote to me in a private email and I thought I had explained to
you why you shouldn't send binary attachments to a newsgroup not
chartered for such. I thought I had gotten that through to you, but I
guess not.

In brief, here are my responses to your non-sequitur rhetoric you
posted publicly he

1) S/MIME IS a binary attachment. That's why the mime type is
"APPLICATION" and encoded with "BASE64". The fact that you can't see
those 60-70 lines of crap doesn't mean that its not there or that its
not binary. PGP has about 4 lines, what's wrong with that?

2) The fact that you have the gall to complain about my 7 lines of
signature when you sent 60-70 for a signature really amazes me -
Notwithstanding your Anti-American comments about my signature.

3) You said I replied to a post with over 200 quoted lines. I'm still
waiting for you to provide evidence of that. I won't say I never did
that, but its not-standard for me to do so. If I did, it was by
mistake. However, your inability to provide proof says that it
probably never happened.

4) My return email address is not hidden. It may be obfuscated to
prevent spambots from getting it, but not in a way that humans can't
understand how to modify it to get the real address. The fact that
you were able to send me email proves that even stupid humans can
figure it out.

5) As for the charter of this newsgroup, do you see the word "BINARY"
or "BINARIES" in the name of this group? Did you see anything in the
charter that said "binaries allowed"? If not, then its a TEXT ONLY
newsgroup. Obviously, you are a few bricks shy of a full load if you
didn't know that. For that matter, how many binary groups are in the
Big-8 groups? Not many the last I checked. Most binary groups I
found were ALT groups.

Lastly, Neb, I will point out that this is a TEXT-ONLY group about
rotorcraft. Its nice that you are a concerned citizen with a video
tape of a helicopter that later had a hard landing and want to get it
to the proper authorities.

However, if you need an education on netiquette, then this is not the
place to get it. However, if you violate netiquette rules on the
massive scale that you did, then you are going to hear about it. You
should do a Google search on such and you'll probably find a few sites
that explain it.

Dennis.


Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

wrote:

Neb,

You are a poster boy for "Bad Netiquette".

Speaking of poster boys - Dennis you need to go and look in a mirror.

Not only are you an idiot and don't understand what you are talking about,

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

3) You said I replied to a post with over 200 quoted lines.

Dennis..... There you go blaming poor Neb for something he didn't do.

I CHASTISED YOU FOR QUOTING 200 LINES OF TEXT.

Looks like you can't even get your attributes right.

I'm still waiting for you to provide evidence of that.

Good Grief...... Like this group is such a hot bed of posters with all
of two posts per day that you can't go back a few days and find
your own posts and read for yourself......... sigh.

I won't say I never did that, but its not-standard for me to do so.

I always trim my posts......

If I did, it was by mistake.

And maybe poor Neb made a mistake just like you made a mistake
thinking that I am he, and he is me.

However, your inability to provide proof says that it
probably never happened.

Sorry Dennis you don't get to dodge your bullet that easy.

OK..... here it is - the subject line for you to look for
from Sunday August 15

4th flight - It wasn't pretty..

The fact that you were able to send me email proves that even
stupid humans can figure it out.

Oh Dennis Dennis Dennis..... And it was just a few paragraphs ago
that you were chastising poor Neb for being rude.

Your comments....

Not only are you an idiot and don't understand what you are
talking about, but you are damn rude as well.

Pot Kettle Black.

Obviously, you are a few bricks shy of a full load if you
didn't know that.

Dennis - I think you need to bend over and pick up some
of those fallen bricks yourself.

However, if you need an education on netiquette, then this is not the
place to get it.

Hmmmmmm..... But Dennis you don't mind giving poor Neb a lesson on
netiquette, but you don't seem to like it when I gave you a lesson
back.

In fact you want me to give you two examples of your transgressions
while you take poor old Neb to task for just one.

Your words exactly from Sunday August 15

However, I do want to see the specific example where you say
I failed to remove the majority of the quoted text.
And, considering how long I've been posting here,
two examples would be nice.

Pot Kettle Black.

However, if you violate netiquette rules on the
massive scale that you did, then you are going to hear about it.

MASSIVE SCALE..... Good grief Charlie Brown is that like SHOCK AND AWE.

You should do a Google search on such and you'll probably find
a few sites that explain it.

And you sir should take your own advice.

And if you in a charitable mood today Dennis then why don't you ditch
that obnoxious SIG file of yours.

After all why should the rest of us have to view it every time you
decide to post to this group.

As you say, this is a group for the discussion on rotorcraft and your
personal comments in your SIG file have nothing to do with the subject
at hand..... now do they.

Neb,

This is the second time that you have posted under a fake name
pretending to be somebody else.

It is clear that your primary intent is to disrupt this newsgroup. As
such, I am telling you that if you do it again, compaints will be
filed against you.

Dennis.

Speaking of Netiquette wrote:

snipped




Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

wrote:

Neb,

This is the second time that you have posted under a fake name
pretending to be somebody else.

Your really this stupid.

I am telling you that if you do it again, compaints will be
filed against you.

Go right ahead.


ME........ IP addy - 161.184.141.129
Edmonton Alberta Canada
the home of tasty Alberta beef
and a Province that is debt free.

NEB........ posting from Ohio State University as far as I can tell.

AND YOU DENNIS ARE DUMBER THAN A STUMP.

Now if you really wish to contact the TELUS corporation and
complain because I have been posting under the same
static IP addy 161.184.141.129 for the past six years,
why Dennis you go right ahead.

Don't forget to remind them that my monthly account is
paid up to date as always.

Hey all,

In case you are wondering, this guy is a troll.
I filed a complaint against him and I learned that it is not the only
complaint either. He has a long list of people on USENET that he has
made enemies of.

Apparently, some people seem to think that he is also a spammer. I
haven't seen any evidence of that, but I see no reason to doubt them.

For those who are care, , or whoever he pretends
to be for the moment, has assembled quite a list of enemies over the
years. Some people may know him under different names like:

My suggestion in rec.aviation.piloting

YOU GOT MAIL in alt.biz,
alt.biz.misc,alt.business,
alt.business.ads,
biz.misc

The DEVIL Made Me Do It in pnw.forsale,
seattle.forsale.misc,
seattle.forsale,
rec.crafts.metalworking

ONE MORE TIME in rec.aviation.homebuilt

Shiver Me Timbers in this group


And the list goes on.....

It is best not to respond directly to a troll so I won't be responding
directly to his abusive comments.

Dennis.


Shiver Me Timbers wrote:

Now if you really wish to contact the TELUS corporation and
complain because I have been posting under the same
static IP addy 161.184.141.129 for the past six years,
why Dennis you go right ahead.

Don't forget to remind them that my monthly account is
paid up to date as always.



Dennis Hawkins
n4mwd AT amsat DOT org (humans know what to do)

To find out what an H-1B is and how Congress is using
them to put Americans out of work, visit the following
web site and click on the "Exporting America" CNN news
video: http://zazona.com/ShameH1B/MediaClips.htm

wrote:

Hey all,

In case you are wondering, this guy is a troll.
I filed a complaint against him and I learned that it is not the only
complaint either.

TO THE GROUP

The other day Dennis cut someone named NEB a new asshole,
for posting a binary to this newsgroup.

Dennis talked about netiquette.

So I pointed out to Dennis that the very same day (Sunday Aug 15) that
he himself had forgotten about netiquette by making a four line comment
and then quoting over two hundred lines of text.

In other words he failed to trim his posts.

Instead of going oooops... MEA CULPA like most people would do
including myself when I've made mistakes... He decided to argue the
point and insisted that I provide him with at least two occaissions
when
he had forgotten to trim a post.

In other words Dennis feels that he can chastise NEB for one
transgression, (posting a binary to a text only group) but If I
chastise Dennis for failing to trim his post then I am supposed to
supply at least two examples.

Isn't that kinda like do as I say not as I do.

Then today for whatever reason Dennis decided to take another swipe at
poor old NEB and in the process accussed NEB of taking him to task over
his failure to trim his post.

I answered Dennis at that stage, for his stupidity in not being able to
seperate myself, whoever I am, in Edmonton Alberta Canada. from someone
obviously posting from a university site in the US of A.

And at that point instead of gritting his teeth and going OOOppps
MEA CULPA for not realizing that he was talking about two different
people regarding two entirely different subject (threads) he decided to
threaten to complain to my ISP.

I told him to go ahead and told him that he had to be dumber than a
stump if he couldn't read the headers and realize that I and NEB are
two different people, in two different countries.

And as you can see Dennis has spent a frustrating few hours going
through GOOGLE and checking out my posting history.

TO THE GROUP ----- I am who I am and for the past six years I have
posted to this group and others under a variety of names many of which
I choose at random as I am making my post.

I don't hide that fact - And considering that my IP address is static,
and has always been 161.184.141.129, nobody could ever complain
that I am trying to be anonymous. That static IP address doesn't lie.

Now in a childish fit of exasperation Dennis has done his Googling,
made his complaint ( supposedly ), and now can't wait to tell all his
friends in the group about the variety of newsgroups that I have posted
into and the different nicknames that I have used over the years.

TO THE GROUP ------- Dennis feels it's okay for him to complain about
someone like NEB but doesn't like it when someone holds him up to the
light of day. So by complaining to my ISP he shows you the people in
this group just how childish he is willing to be in his attempt to try
to squirm around the fact that he himself is guilty of poor netiquette
the other day just as much as poor old NEB was.

And not only that folks but he is so stupid that he can't even get his
attributes right and figure out who is making what comments and from
what country.

Now that you have shown the world how immature you are Dennis, let me
tell you in one word what my ISP will do if in fact you actually
complained........ NOTHING.

You see Dennis as a paying customer for six years I don't think my ISP
is going to want to turn down my monthly payment for something as
trivial as your complaint. Especially in light of the fact that every
three months their main competitor in this neck of the woods phones me,
and asks for my business.

TO THE GROUP ------- I'm sure you have all been reading this thread
with baited breath, after all it's about the most exciting thing to
happen to this group in months. But lets face it, Dennis got caught
with his hand in the cookie jar and has been trying all afternoon to
squirm out of the facts of the matter, which are clearly available for
all of you regulars and lurkers to read. I'm sure we are all having a
good chuckle over it..... That is everyone except Dennis.

So Dennis ------ You got caught in your own words, and argueing
the issue doesn't change the facts, so GROW UP and start acting
like a mature adult.

Trust me Dennis you will feel much better in a few days, and I will
still be here from time to time posting under whatever name I choose
from the same IP addy 161.184.141.129 the same as always.

That's life, deal with it.

FUT: alt.security

"Shiver Me Timbers" wrote in message
...
wrote:

Neb,

This is the second time that you have posted under a fake name
pretending to be somebody else.

Your really this stupid.

I am telling you that if you do it again, compaints will be
filed against you.

Go right ahead.


ME........ IP addy - 161.184.141.129
Edmonton Alberta Canada
the home of tasty Alberta beef
and a Province that is debt free.

NEB........ posting from Ohio State University as far as I can tell.

AND YOU DENNIS ARE DUMBER THAN A STUMP.

Sounds like I should continue to digitally sign all of my posts to this
group to eliminate the confusion in the future.

I can see how someone with a non-S/MIME capable client might interpret the
cleartext signature as "binary".

The issue with binaries though is their massive size and S/MIME signatures
are smaller than the average post from "The OTHER Kevin in San Diego" which
I do enjoy reading.

Considering the small size, it shouldn't pose a measurable problem -
especially since I mostly lurk here - unless I'm trying to ask helicopter
pilots how to deal with the FAA when I video tape a crash or something.

And I'd also like to point out that NNTP "abuse" complaints for every ISP
I've ever seen require that the newsgroup charter specifically prohibit the
behavior that is considered abuse.

There is no "rec.aviation.binaries" newsgroup that I am aware of - and in
this case it is customary (in the case of large files such as images) to
warn folks and ask if they mind in advance.

S/MIME signed emails should not evoke fears of some slippery slope where
people will start posting images, flight simulator add-ons, and DVD rips to
the newsgroups.

People should really be able to deal with digital signatures by now. They
are nothing new to Usenet since over 2.5 million posts have been digitally
signed to date.

I've posted hundreds myself over the past few years with only a handful of
objections - largely from people who simply didn't understand and like to
"mother hen" everyone.

wrote in message
...

Neb,

% Ad-hominem attacks snipped %



2) The fact that you have the gall to complain about my 7 lines of
signature when you sent 60-70 for a signature really amazes me -

They're different types of signatures completely. Mine is for security,
yours is to complain about foreigners stealing jobs you apparenly think you
could or would want to do.


Notwithstanding your Anti-American comments about my signature.

It'd be funny if I wasn't an American, wouldn't it. :P

America is great because we absorb the rebels and intellectuals from other
countries. Chances are your own ancestors were immigrants at some point, so
it seems silly to me to object when people apply to LEAGALLY work in the US.

You might find this to be an interesting read on the subject:

http://www.reason.com/0407/fe.bl.truths.shtml


3) You said I replied to a post with over 200 quoted lines.

False.


4) My return email address is not hidden. It may be obfuscated to
prevent spambots from getting it, but not in a way that humans can't
understand how to modify it to get the real address.

It's a pain in the butt - and considered poor netiquette by many.


5) As for the charter of this newsgroup, do you see the word "BINARY"
or "BINARIES" in the name of this group? Did you see anything in the
charter that said "binaries allowed"? If not, then its a TEXT ONLY
newsgroup.

Says you. The newsgroup charter takes no position on the matter - nor does
the rec.aviation charter if we assume a cascading approach.

And even if it did, we should weigh the advantages to knowing a message
isn't spoofed or altered with the disadvantages of the meager increase in
file size. An S/MIME signature isn't anywhere near the size of a GIF or
JPG - and my signed message was smaller than some of the regular posts to
the group. And so far this thread has balooned to 5 times the size of a
single digital signature.


Lastly, Neb, I will point out that this is a TEXT-ONLY group about
rotorcraft.

Doesn't say that in the charter.


However, if you need an education on netiquette, then this is not the
place to get it.

Obviously, given your record. Usenet-wise, you're a low-time pilot with an
authoritarian streak. For the FOURTH time - if a 6kb post makes you flip
out, plonk/killfile me. I can only assume you don't know how at this point.


However, if you violate netiquette rules on the
massive scale that you did, then you are going to hear about it.

Hmmm...
A single 6kb post... "Massive scale"...