Spinning the SZD 50-3

Tim,

I've experienced exactly the same scenario (spin flattening) in the
G103. It began with a penulum motion of the logitudinal axis, quickly
progessing to a point where the apex was above the horizon and the
nadir nearly vertical. Then it simply parked the nose a few degrees
below the horizon and continued to spin. It was very slow to recover.
So much so that I started pumping the stick and cycling the spoilers.

Since then I recover at first sign of these oscillations, though I
typically wait for the nose to rise before releasing the stick (a much
more graceful, less nose down recovery that way).

It is very possible that you have found a mode that makes the Puch
unreliable for spin training. At least the Grob gives some warning.
But it only spins to the left with the trim handle full forward and
the cg well aft.

(Tim Shea) wrote in message om...
I love to spin. It's exciting. I took aerobatic training with Wayne
Handley and was taught spin recoveries by him.

I have direct experience spinning the Puchacz at Minden. This is what
I remember from my experience. Your mileage may vary.
With friends (usually lighter than me) in the front, I spun it while
sitting in the back seat more than a dozen times. The CG was within
the published range and I didn't have any trouble with simple
recovery- stick centered and forward and rudder away from the
direction of rotation. Worked great.
I should mention that I used to be 50 lbs heavier than I am now, but
still in the published range for the plane.
During the training towards my instructors rating, I spun the Puch
twice with my instructor. The first 2 or so rotation spin I was able
to recover normally, no sweat. The second manuver was quite different.
I was asked to let the spin develop a little deeper for the second.
After 4 or so rotations, the nose seemed to float up and the rotation
*seemed* to slow considerably. I remember thinking that this is cool!
Kind of like floating. When it was time for the recovery I applied the
control inputs I'd been taught (as specified above) and much to my
surprise, nothing different happened.....for a long time. I estimate
that we completed another 5+ rotations nose high before it broke,
rolled over and recovered. I had the stick centered and against the
front stop with the rudder also pegged away from the rotation. We
recovered with several (4 or 5) thousand feet under us (we'd been
playing at cloudbase at about 15K).
Once on the ground, we discussed this incident in the grumpy bar for
at least an hour. I (and he) decided to never spin the Puch again. I
didn't. I doubt he did either.
I had heard of this happening before. I assumed that it was from
operation outside of the design envelope. Apparently I was wrong.
John Shelton probably said it best: "On my own as a test pilot, I will
certainly get killed". I felt like a dumb-ass for quite a while (more
than usual) after that.

(Chris OCallaghan) wrote in message . com...
SNIP portion

It is very possible that you have found a mode that makes the Puch
unreliable for spin training. At least the Grob gives some warning.
But it only spins to the left with the trim handle full forward and
the cg well aft.

Chris:

There is a very reasonable explanation for why you found the left
rotation to be true. Do you know what it is? Would you tell the
group? (All Grob pilots should know.)

But the answer will not be 'always' true for each serial number of
same models of Grobs. Spins are variable polynomial equations.

Cindy B
Caracole Soaring



(Tim Shea) wrote in message om...
SNIPPED portion
John Shelton probably said it best: "On my own as a test pilot, I will
certainly get killed". I felt like a dumb-ass for quite a while (more
than usual) after that.

On 30 Jan 2004 20:34:48 -0800, (Caracole) wrote:


There is a very reasonable explanation for why you found the left
rotation to be true. Do you know what it is? Would you tell the
group? (All Grob pilots should know.)

Asymmetric rudder (hinged at the left side, therefore better rudder
autority to the left).

Bye
Andreas