Any news from IGC?

50 km silver - the 50 km has to be one leg in a straight stripe - read
2.1.1.a . You're going to have to get 25 km from the airfield.

Ian

In article ,
tango4 wrote:
50 km silver - the 50 km has to be one leg in a straight stripe - read
2.1.1.a . You're going to have to get 25 km from the airfield.

Ian

Darn good thing SOMEBODY is willing to look at the regs.

Thanks Ian! I thought that 3.3nm from the airport was a little
absurd...
--

------------+
Mark Boyd
Avenal, California, USA

Oh yes, you right! I will try it this summer

Denis wrote:

Janos Bauer wrote:

Theoretically you don't have to go further than 125km from your home on
a 500km task.

it's actually 83.333 km only !

No. For competitions the distance is calculated to
each nominated turning point and as far as the competiton
is concerned is the set distance. A competitor entering
the beer can is deemed to have reached the turning
point and turned it. To claim a badge you have to enter
the observation sector of the declared turning point,
which is a different animal altogether. I suppose if
you wanted to you could declare seperately a point
nearest to the last TP on the target beer can but you
would still have to enter the observation zone for
this new TP. The distance for the badge claim would
be the distance between the new offset TPs and for
the comp it would still be the original set TPs.

At 02:42 12 March 2004, Mark James Boyd wrote:
In article ,
Denis wrote:
Tim Newport-Peace wrote:

It is however important to remember that the 'observation'
zones for
Competitions and Badges are slightly different, and
if you intend to
claim a badge you need to go a bit further into the
zone.

At least until 1st Oct 2004, where beer can will be
included in the OZ
even for badges or records

I assume that like competitions, distance will be calculated
by
the furthest point into the beer can...right?

Do you have a reference for this? How big is the beer
can?

--

------------+
Mark Boyd
Avenal, California, USA

On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 11:24:49 UTC, Ian Strachan
wrote:

: What IGC decided last month was to confirm the general procedure adopted
: last year. That is, changes of IGC-approval level have to have the
: agreement not only of GFAC but also of the GNSS Committee and the IGC
: Bureau. As with all Bureau and other decisions between full IGC Plenary
: meetings, the Plenary (as the highest IGC body) confirms (or otherwise)
: those decisions made on its behalf during the year.

Thank goodness gliding is a hobby, eh? I'd hate to see it tied up with
lots of committees like the rest of aviation.

Ian


--

Mark James Boyd wrote:

At least until 1st Oct 2004, where beer can will be included in the OZ
even for badges or records


I assume that like competitions, distance will be calculated by
the furthest point into the beer can...right?

I don't know which competitions you are speaking about, nor their
particular rules. I am refeering to SC3 annex A, where the distance is
calculated by the turn point itself, center of the beer can.

Do you have a reference for this? How big is the beer can?

Look at the agenda of 2004 IGC meeting on www.fai.org/gliding site (I
don't know if the proposal has been approved by the plenary, but it is
likely because it was a year 2 proposal) .

The beer can has a 500 m radius like in Annex A, and 1 km is subtracted
from the distance at each turnpoint when beer can is used.

Unfortunately there is now two ways of declaring a turn point : with
usual observation zone (90° quadrant) *or* with target zone (beer can).
And I don't know how this can be done in any electronic delaration ! Not
speaking from the mess in analysis softwares with several possible task
distances from the same turn points !

--
Denis

R. Parce que ça rompt le cours normal de la conversation !!!
Q. Pourquoi ne faut-il pas répondre au-dessus de la question ?

Mark James Boyd wrote:

I have to point out a confusion that I had as well about
definitions.

A "free 3TP" task means the 3 turnpoints are declared
before the flight, but the order of the turnpoints, and
whether 1,2,or all 3 turnpoints are claimed
is declared after the flight. I haven't seen this clearly explained
anywhere but on some of the declaration forms themselves.

You're right twice. It is correct (for badges), and not clear at all :-(((

This is different from what I would conceptually
consider "free," which is when three turnpoins would
be chosen after the flight from the three points on the gps trace
which are furthest apart.

That's the "free distance with up to 3 turn points for records"

Anyone with more comment on this please correct me if
this is mistaken...I've only flown one free 3TP record,
and the "free 3TP" task and form were what I used.

In short, the "free 3TP" is free for records, and declared (except the
finish point and the sequence) for badges.

This may be explained by historical reasons, but nowadays it is a full
nonsense : the logic would implie that there be "free 3TP" -- like
actual 3 TP for records -- and (declared) 3 TP -- like actual 3 TP for
badges, but with declared finish point and TP sequence.

Furthermore, there should be an additionnal record category for
"declared 3TP" now that every other type of task ( straight distance,
out&return, triangles) have both declared and free records !

But is IGC any logical ? :-(((

--
Denis

R. Parce que ça rompt le cours normal de la conversation !!!
Q. Pourquoi ne faut-il pas répondre au-dessus de la question ?

Tim Newport-Peace wrote:

4.2.1 Declaration content
--------snip
e. Way points and the sequence to be flown, start, turn(s), finish/goal
as applicable to the specific soaring performance *

I suppose that "as applicable to the specific soaring performance" means
that "sequence" -- as well as goal ! -- are not applicable to the free
distance w/3TP, or that you must declare it, but you need not fly it as
declared (!)

--
Denis

R. Parce que ça rompt le cours normal de la conversation !!!
Q. Pourquoi ne faut-il pas répondre au-dessus de la question ?

Denis wrote:

I don't know which competitions you are speaking about, nor their
particular rules. I am refeering to SC3 annex A, where the distance is
calculated by the turn point itself, center of the beer can.

Do you have a reference for this? How big is the beer can?

Look at the agenda of 2004 IGC meeting on www.fai.org/gliding site (I
don't know if the proposal has been approved by the plenary, but it is
likely because it was a year 2 proposal) .

The beer can has a 500 m radius like in Annex A, and 1 km is subtracted
from the distance at each turnpoint when beer can is used.

Hmmmm...I wonder if I declare a course which is 300.1 KM, and
then go fly it by turning each point just outside the point by
a few hundred meters, if this means I will be 3 KM short...

I suppose for any task it makes sense to tack on a few extra km,
and be extra sure to hit the OZ (maybe two tight turns around the point)
to make absolutely sure...

Still dunno why a beer can was ever introduced for anything...
See old threads for arguments on this...
--

------------+
Mark Boyd
Avenal, California, USA

In article ,
Denis wrote:
Mark James Boyd wrote:

I have to point out a confusion that I had as well about
definitions.

A "free 3TP" task means the 3 turnpoints are declared
before the flight, but the order of the turnpoints, and
whether 1,2,or all 3 turnpoints are claimed
is declared after the flight. I haven't seen this clearly explained
anywhere but on some of the declaration forms themselves.

You're right twice. It is correct (for badges), and not clear at all :-(((

This is different from what I would conceptually
consider "free," which is when three turnpoins would
be chosen after the flight from the three points on the gps trace
which are furthest apart.

That's the "free distance with up to 3 turn points for records"

Anyone with more comment on this please correct me if
this is mistaken...I've only flown one free 3TP record,
and the "free 3TP" task and form were what I used.

In short, the "free 3TP" is free for records, and declared (except the
finish point and the sequence) for badges.

This may be explained by historical reasons, but nowadays it is a full
nonsense : the logic would implie that there be "free 3TP" -- like
actual 3 TP for records -- and (declared) 3 TP -- like actual 3 TP for
badges, but with declared finish point and TP sequence.

Furthermore, there should be an additionnal record category for
"declared 3TP" now that every other type of task ( straight distance,
out&return, triangles) have both declared and free records !

Well, you've done a much better job clarifying that. I didn't
know the record "free 3TP" could be points declared after the
flight. Interesting...
--

------------+
Mark Boyd
Avenal, California, USA