How Low to Spin??

Andreas Maurer wrote:

On Sat, 04 Sep 2004 22:39:48 GMT, "Vaughn"
wrote:



I've also had them frozen shut, but another reason for checking them is
to activate the gear warning if the gear isn't down and locked. That has
warned me at least 3 times.

Damn good point! Also, it allows you to check that your hand is on the
right handle (think Blanik)


Very good point!

Think ASW-27 - we had a very experienced pilot land my club's 27 this
weekend with the flap lever only. Touched down at the end of the 2.000
ft runway and used up the (inofficial) 500 ft overrun before he was
barely able to stop it by dropping a wing and doing a quick 110
degrees turn a couple of feet in front of a vineyard.

He never even wondered why his "airbrake" lever didn't have the
slightest braking action.

Second time this has ahappened at my home airfield - the last time was
ten years agon in an ASW-20.

I've had several people recommend having a look at the wing when you
open the airbrakes, to see if they actually appear! I did this while
training students in our Blanik (the flap and airbrakes handles are very
close), but it is good advice for any glider. It is also good advice if
the glider does not seem to be climbing well (on tow or under power)
and, as Andreas mentions, when it is not coming down well!

--
Change "netto" to "net" to email me directly

Eric Greenwell
Washington State
USA

Hi Chris
I quite like the "lookout" element of USTALL (though I don't actually chant
the checklist to myself on circuit). What I use it for is a reminder that,
in addition to my normal lookout, I also need to pay attention to the other
side of the circuit, look for aircraft on long, straight in approaches, and
look at what's happening on the ground. This is a different mode of lookout
to XC or local soaring, and I usually find myself muttering "lookout" at
some point to remind me of the change of mode.
You are right in that it should be automatic to be scanning the sky, but that is
not what I was taught the "lookout" item was for.
"Lookout" reminds you to look in different places - you are going to land, check
that the ground condition is good - runway clear, no cars/ gliders/ kids/
microlights or cows. YOu should already be looking for conflicting aerial traffic.


But I take the point - if the pilot doesn't lookout except in response to a
checklist, I'd like to be in a different part of the sky.

S (straps or speed?) is pretty useless on downwind, T (trim) ditto, and A
(airbrakes I think) is wierd - if you can't find them you're in trouble,
though if I flew a flapped glider or had the UC lever on the same side as
the airbrake (LS4s excepted) I'd add a mental note to check which lever I
intended to use for approach control.

Look at the statistics of experienced pilots damaging aircraft and themselves
because they tried to adjust their descent rate with the flaps or worse
undercarriage. Maybe the hoary old pilots with thousands of hours always know
they have their hand on the blue lever when they want to. Me- I still find it
useful to consciously think "what glider am I in, OK put your hand on the
airbrake lever, and crack them to be sure" Then I know I have my brakes sorted.

Same thing with speed and trim, just helps to think explicitly about how fast
you are landing.

U is quite clear in my mind, having landed wheels up once already, and
hoping not to do it again.

"Ian Johnston" wrote in message
news:cCUlhtvFIYkV-pn2-zikdWvOGpoiF@localhost...

You should see some of the downwind checklists/mnemonics in use in the
UK. They include things like "trim" - for people who wouldn't normally
think of using the trimmer, I presume - and, most bizarrely of all,
"lookout". I'm not sure that I want to share the sky with people who
need a mnemonic to remind them to look out...



The trim thing is also a safety thing, high workload tends to result in people
forgetting things like trim. Flying the circuit with some residual pressure on
the stick can have interesting effects when you get distracted. Tends to happen
after a long fast final glide - to me at any rate. More to the point what speed
are you trimming for - are you sure it is right.

It's a good discipline to use the checklist - much more important to understand
why each item is there. If all you are doing is going "lookout - check I am
looking out" you are wasting your time with the checklist.

No personal slight intended, but as a general comment I have found that if I
find there is a generally accepted practice in flying that one can't see the
value of, it is important to find out why it has become generally accepted
practice. Most glider pilots are not fools. (well with the possible exception of
irrational desire for more span) Generally I have found good reasons for most of
the habits and standards, even if they are not always entirely obvious. Ricardo
Semler claims you should always ask Why? three times at least. Works for me.

Bruce

On Sat, 4 Sep 2004 19:00:35 UTC, Bruce Greeff
wrote:

: It's a good discipline to use the checklist - much more important to understand
: why each item is there. If all you are doing is going "lookout - check I am
: looking out" you are wasting your time with the checklist.
:
: No personal slight intended, but as a general comment I have found that if I
: find there is a generally accepted practice in flying that one can't see the
: value of, it is important to find out why it has become generally accepted
: practice.

A good point. The difficulty comes from an inherent contradiction: if
safety comes from considering your (ie one's) actions fully, surely
accepting somebody else's checklist is quite the opposite? Not to
mention the problem that - in the UK anyway - there is no genrally
accepted practice. There are lots of different versions of the
downwind check list - which should one use? Should it always be the
longest possible?

Personally, I think the best idea is to work out a personal check
list, where each item appears as a result of thought and decision.
And, of course, discussion with other pilots and instructors,
intelligent reading of accident reports and so on.

I use USTAL. U(ndercarriage) is there because I normally fly wooden
gliders, and it reminds me to think about whether there is a skid
there to use in extremis. It's a good time to rethink my target
S(peed). T(rim) is pointless, I reckon, but I can't forget it, damn
it. A(irbrakes) might freeze shut and L(anding area) is my cue to make
sure that I have Plans A, B and C clear in my mind.

I don't waste time reminding myself that I don't have F(laps) or
W(ater), and I've thought about (W)ind long, long before. And I don't
mutter L(ookout) to myself because it might distract me from the
important business of looking out.

Ian

PS And why on earth do we, before launch, check the controls before
making sure that we're within the weight limits for the glider?

Ian Johnston wrote:

Personally, I think the best idea is to work out a personal check
list, where each item appears as a result of thought and decision.
And, of course, discussion with other pilots and instructors,
intelligent reading of accident reports and so on.

!!!!

Absolutely. I'm a big fan of teaching pilots to evaluate their own
weaknesses too. They make checklists which focus on the things
they are likely to do wrong. I have three pilots who fly one
partnership aircraft, and they all use their own custom checklist.
Two are long and pedantic, one is shorter and much more focussed,
but each works well for the personality of the pilot.

And from this thread, there have been some excellent points, but
it seems clear we all use different checklists based on our
varying needs and aircraft...

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Mark Boyd
Avenal, California, USA