Visulalizing the Finish Cylinder

Rotate the gate?
Alternate gates?
My God, we got people that can't remember which way to finish and your
solution is to use the finish line one day and the finish cylinder, the
next? Have you ever heard the term KISS? It stands for Keep It Simple,
Stupid and is a time honered way to prevent screw-ups. We have contests
with several classes and they don't all go on the same task. To further
complicate things, we often change tasks, sometimes in the air. The
KISS rule is now streatched pretty thin and you want to add another
layer of confusion by "rotating the gate"? Which way and for which
class? BTW, rotating doesn't solve anything, the pilots will still head
for the nearest corner, won't they?
I see your comments as nothing more than attempt to keep alive a dying
dinosaur, so that you can continue to have "fun". P7 shared his near
death experience in the dinosaur gate and you told him there was poor
judgement and ignorance involved. Well, now we have a point on which we
can agree; Poor judgement to keep using the proven unsafe finish gate
and ignorance on the part of an organization that continues to allow
its use.
JJ Sinclair
BTW, you'll see no dinosaurs at Montague.

JJ, I'm genuinely surprised. You're getting hornery in your old age!
And maybe just a little too uncivil... ;-)

Let's get one thing clear. I've asked, repeatedly, for you to explain
how we're to manage traffic on the face of cylinder during ASTs. And
you've offered NOTHING specific, except to imply that I simply don't
get it. I am raising valid concerns, have put some small effort into
explaining my concerns in prose and pictures, and I'm getting dogmatc
replies. Which tells me that there aren't well-reasoned answers, yet.
They'll come, I'm sure, but apparently not until we've scared ourselves
silly a few times as we learn the disadvantages of the cylinder by
trial and error. Note that other than Montague last year (only 13
competitors), I'm not aware of a cylinder being used for non MAT tasks
at the Stds, 15s, 18, or Open Nats... that is, we haven't tested it in
conditions where a dozen or more gliders of equal performance might
approach the cyliner in a very short span of time.

I accept that you've established yourself as the Cylindrical Champion
and thus accept a certain amount of righteous indignation that I and
others might prefer and justify demon finish lines. But now you need to
convince a few of us who have valid concerns about high/low speed
conflicts that these have been thought through and adequately
addressed.

As I noted earlier, I see the dynamics of the cylinder as very much
similar to the old start gate. Worse, since the effective gate size is
smaller and the wing level runs much longer (at least in the start gate
you were able to scan traffic for several minutes while circling at the
IP prior to your run - even so, it was a anxious half minute in the
gate).


C'mon JJ. Give me some substance. Show me some real numbers. Use my
valid assumptions to prove me wrong instead of offering up an idyllic
paint by numbers picture.

Cheers,

Chris O'Callaghan

How about you going flying a little bit more instead of running dry
arguments on a newsgroup?

--
Bert Willing

ASW20 "TW"


a écrit dans le message de news:
...
JJ, I'm genuinely surprised. You're getting hornery in your old age!
And maybe just a little too uncivil... ;-)

Let's get one thing clear. I've asked, repeatedly, for you to explain
how we're to manage traffic on the face of cylinder during ASTs. And
you've offered NOTHING specific, except to imply that I simply don't
get it. I am raising valid concerns, have put some small effort into
explaining my concerns in prose and pictures, and I'm getting dogmatc
replies. Which tells me that there aren't well-reasoned answers, yet.
They'll come, I'm sure, but apparently not until we've scared ourselves
silly a few times as we learn the disadvantages of the cylinder by
trial and error. Note that other than Montague last year (only 13
competitors), I'm not aware of a cylinder being used for non MAT tasks
at the Stds, 15s, 18, or Open Nats... that is, we haven't tested it in
conditions where a dozen or more gliders of equal performance might
approach the cyliner in a very short span of time.

I accept that you've established yourself as the Cylindrical Champion
and thus accept a certain amount of righteous indignation that I and
others might prefer and justify demon finish lines. But now you need to
convince a few of us who have valid concerns about high/low speed
conflicts that these have been thought through and adequately
addressed.

As I noted earlier, I see the dynamics of the cylinder as very much
similar to the old start gate. Worse, since the effective gate size is
smaller and the wing level runs much longer (at least in the start gate
you were able to scan traffic for several minutes while circling at the
IP prior to your run - even so, it was a anxious half minute in the
gate).


C'mon JJ. Give me some substance. Show me some real numbers. Use my
valid assumptions to prove me wrong instead of offering up an idyllic
paint by numbers picture.

Cheers,

Chris O'Callaghan