Russian Carrier puts to Sea

TOliver wrote:

"Tiger" wrote in message
...

Russian Aircraft Carrier On Its Way to North Atlantic
By AGENCE FRANCE-PRESSE, MOSCOW

The Russian aircraft carrier Admiral Kuznetsov left the port of Murmansk
on March 23 to carry out military exercises in the north Atlantic, Russian
news reports said.

For two weeks, the Admiral Kuznetsov will implement a series of military
exercises involving the airplanes on board, ITAR-TASS quoted the Russian
Navy chief-of-command as saying.

More than 40 takeoffs are scheduled to take place during the exercises.



Counting bolters, bingos and senior officer RONs, arrested landing will
likely be less than half that (if things go as planned).

Ahhh, give me the good old days when you could see 40 cat shots long before
being relieved for lunch. Come to think of it, by Summer's early light,
I've seen that many before being relieved (early) for the Forenoon.

Not many Centurions in Russian NAVAIR.....

TMO



Nor will there ever be - as the Admiral Kuznetsov does not 'do' cat shots.

It has a ski ramp - the resident Su-33's wind up to full power and are
held back by retractable 'fingers' in front of the mainwheels.

When these retract, the a/c accelerates up over the ramp.

The Kuznetsov has four arresting wires - and is therfore a 'STOBAR' design.

They did look into - and even built - a working catapult, but rejected
it in favour of the ski jump.

Ken

See my pages at
http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/...ges/su-27k.htm

Ken Duffey wrote:

:The Kuznetsov has four arresting wires - and is therfore a 'STOBAR' design.

You're going to have to explain where the back half of that acronym
comes from.

Short Take Off But Arrested Recovery

http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/STOBAR

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STOBAR

http://www.sciencedaily.com/encyclopedia/stobar

Ken

Fred J. McCall wrote:
Ken Duffey wrote:

:The Kuznetsov has four arresting wires - and is therfore a 'STOBAR' design.

You're going to have to explain where the back half of that acronym
comes from.

Ken Duffey wrote:

Short Take Off But Arrested Recovery

http://www.nationmaster.com/encyclopedia/STOBAR

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STOBAR

http://www.sciencedaily.com/encyclopedia/stobar

Ken

Fred J. McCall wrote:
Ken Duffey wrote:

:The Kuznetsov has four arresting wires - and is therfore a 'STOBAR' design.

You're going to have to explain where the back half of that acronym
comes from.

Whereas US, French and Brazilian CV/CVNs are described as CATOBAR, and everything
else (at the moment) is STOVL.

Guy

"Guy Alcala" a écrit dans le message
news: ...
Ken Duffey wrote:
(snip)
Whereas US, French and Brazilian CV/CVNs are described as CATOBAR, and
everything
else (at the moment) is STOVL.

Guy

CTOL for conventional take-off and landing seems more appropriate.
Why does one want a B in CATOBAR ? is there any catapult take-off and
vertical landing ?

Christophe

Christophe Chazot wrote:
"Guy Alcala" a écrit dans le message
news: ...

Ken Duffey wrote:

(snip)

Whereas US, French and Brazilian CV/CVNs are described as CATOBAR, and

everything

else (at the moment) is STOVL.

Guy


CTOL for conventional take-off and landing seems more appropriate.
Why does one want a B in CATOBAR ? is there any catapult take-off and
vertical landing ?

Christophe



CTOL, STOL, VTOL, VSTOL all refer to land-based ops.

Carrier launches are anything but 'conventional' - hence the CATO bit.

I guess you have to add BAR to differentiate it from a VL - as in a Harrier.

That would be STOVL ??

So, for carrier ops you can CATO or STO to launch and BAR or VL to
recover - and mix-and-match to suit ....

CATOBAR, STOBAR, STOVL - but no CATOVL (AFAIK) ??

I agree about the B bit - why would you want to add 'But' ?? - you
don't say 'Short Take Off BUT Vertical Landing' - STOBVL do you ??

Ken

Ken Duffey wrote:
snip

CATOBAR, STOBAR, STOVL - but no CATOVL (AFAIK) ??

I agree about the B bit - why would you want to add 'But' ?? - you
don't say 'Short Take Off BUT Vertical Landing' - STOBVL do you ??

Ken

We used to talk about CV and STOVL when it came to embarked fast-jets
and everyone knew what was meant. Don't know who came up with the term
"STOBAR" but I suspect it was already being done before BAe (as was) got
all excited at the prospect of a "Navalised" EFA. Given that combat
aircraft used to get airborne from carriers for years without catapults,
the "S" in STOBAR would appear to mean "Ski-jump" in practice (otherwise
use the term "LWUT" - Like We Used To). As for the "B", I think this
comes under the "Law of acronyms" which says you get the acronym first
and explain it later, if forced to.

As for what you term CATOVL, you perhaps may recall the P1154RN, which
the RN wanted to cat launch (hence replacing the original P1154's
bicycle gear with a tricycle layout) but presumably would VL whenever
possible for embarked ops.

Ken Duffey wrote:
Christophe Chazot wrote:
"Guy Alcala" a =E9crit dans le
message
news: ...

Ken Duffey wrote:

(snip)

Whereas US, French and Brazilian CV/CVNs are described as CATOBAR,
and

everything

else (at the moment) is STOVL.

Guy

CTOL for conventional take-off and landing seems more appropriate.
Why does one want a B in CATOBAR ? is there any catapult take-off
and
vertical landing ?

Christophe



CTOL, STOL, VTOL, VSTOL all refer to land-based ops.

Carrier launches are anything but 'conventional' - hence the CATO
bit.

I guess you have to add BAR to differentiate it from a VL - as in a
Harrier.

That would be STOVL ??

So, for carrier ops you can CATO or STO to launch and BAR or VL to
recover - and mix-and-match to suit ....

CATOBAR, STOBAR, STOVL - but no CATOVL (AFAIK) ??

I agree about the B bit - why would you want to add 'But' ?? - you
don't say 'Short Take Off BUT Vertical Landing' - STOBVL do you ??

Ken


What did they call the Royal Navy's Harrier Carriers? I thought it was
V/STOL. (Vertical or Short Take Off and Landing.)

"Ken Duffey" a écrit dans le message
news: ...
(snip)

CTOL, STOL, VTOL, VSTOL all refer to land-based ops.

Arf. And Invincible is not a STOVL ship ?

(re-snip)
I agree about the B bit - why would you want to add 'But' ?? - you
don't say 'Short Take Off BUT Vertical Landing' - STOBVL do you ??

Ken


I don't either, as I wrote, that's why I don't see why there is one B in
CATOBAR. Catapult take-off BUT arrested recovery ?

Christophe

"Christophe Chazot" wrote in message
...

"Guy Alcala" a écrit dans le message
news: ...
Ken Duffey wrote:
(snip)
Whereas US, French and Brazilian CV/CVNs are described as CATOBAR, and
everything
else (at the moment) is STOVL.

Guy

CTOL for conventional take-off and landing seems more appropriate.
Why does one want a B in CATOBAR ? is there any catapult take-off and
vertical landing ?


Guessing here, did it once stand for Barrier Assisted Recovery (i.e. a net).
But as the barriers became out of favor, the acronym was reworked?

Was the CATOBAR phrase used during WWI or WWII? Or is it a more modern
acronym?

John Gilbert