ADIZ pilot's ticket revoked

Actual conditions outrank FSS or DUATS. Think about it.

I did. Then I remembered lawyers.


--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot

-I can gather all the news I need
on the weather report-


"Dave Stadt" wrote in message
...

"Dave A." wrote in message
news:HEkle.274$zb.28@trndny02...
We are taught for the Oral exam that the only way you can prove you took
off
into legal minimums for VFR flight is to obtain a weather briefing from
the
FSS or DUATS.

How does FSS or DUATS know what the conditions are at the thousands of
airports without weather reporting?

It is only the FSS or DUATS weather report for that time that determines
if
you are legally allowed to be flying based on your restrictions, whatever
they may be.



Your local tower or TV station might tell you the weather is one thing,
but
if the FSS says it isn't you could be in violation.

I don't know what kind of documentation you are looking for, but I have
been
told that I will be wrong if I don't answer the question with the FAA
examiner this way.
--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot

"Dave A." wrote in message
news:fcwle.3544$zb.3181@trndny01...
Actual conditions outrank FSS or DUATS. Think about it.

I did. Then I remembered lawyers.

So you would launch if actual conditions were below minimums but FSS said
things were OK. Interesting, but not condusive to a long life.

--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot

-I can gather all the news I need
on the weather report-

Dave Stadt wrote:

So you would launch if actual conditions were below minimums but FSS said
things were OK. Interesting, but not condusive to a long life.

I think he meant the other way 'round. When I was based at Kupper, the nearest
reporting station was Newark. Newark's on the coast and frequently has IMC when
Kupper is VFR. I remember an FAA inspector telling a safety meeting group that
we were technically illegal if we flew VFR when EWR was IFR. I don't think any
of us changed our habits as a result of that statement. I certainly didn't.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

In article x2xle.2405$Lb.1000@trndny05, George Patterson wrote:
Kupper is VFR. I remember an FAA inspector telling a safety meeting group that
we were technically illegal if we flew VFR when EWR was IFR. I don't think any
of us changed our habits as a result of that statement. I certainly didn't.

Well, quite possibly because the FAA inspector was technically wrong.
Whether you're legal VFR or not depends on the conditions at your point
in space and time, not what some weather station several miles away
might be reporting. Otherwise, the corollary of what the FAA inspector
says is that you are technically LEGAL if it's 200 and 1/2 so long as
EWR is reporting VFR.

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

Well, quite possibly because the FAA inspector was technically wrong.
Whether you're legal VFR or not depends on the conditions at your point
in space and time, not what some weather station several miles away
might be reporting.

The question was, what is a legal briefing and where is it stated in the
regulations. If you take off in the conditions stated by George Patternson
you are technically flying illegal.

The philosophizing on the subject aside, all indications given by the FAA
is that the FSS and DUATS weather and NOTAMS are your only proof should
legal proceedings take place that you followed 91.103. Being that the FAA
is the regulatory body, they will impose the fine based on their judgments.





--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot

-I can gather all the news I need
on the weather report-

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
In article x2xle.2405$Lb.1000@trndny05, George Patterson wrote:
Kupper is VFR. I remember an FAA inspector telling a safety meeting group
that
we were technically illegal if we flew VFR when EWR was IFR. I don't
think any
of us changed our habits as a result of that statement. I certainly
didn't.

Otherwise, the corollary of what the FAA inspector
says is that you are technically LEGAL if it's 200 and 1/2 so long as
EWR is reporting VFR.

--
Dylan Smith, Castletown, Isle of Man
Flying: http://www.dylansmith.net
Frontier Elite Universe: http://www.alioth.net
"Maintain thine airspeed, lest the ground come up and smite thee"

Recently, Dave A. posted:

Well, quite possibly because the FAA inspector was technically wrong.
Whether you're legal VFR or not depends on the conditions at your
point in space and time, not what some weather station several miles
away might be reporting.

The question was, what is a legal briefing and where is it stated in
the regulations. If you take off in the conditions stated by George
Patternson you are technically flying illegal.

Then, why do Pireps trump briefings? Whether one is "flying illegal" is
determined by the conditions where one is flying, not the conditions
elsewhere.

The philosophizing on the subject aside, all indications given by
the FAA is that the FSS and DUATS weather and NOTAMS are your only
proof should legal proceedings take place that you followed 91.103.

This is a somewhat different matter. Should one need such proof, FSS and
DUATS may be the only sources that are not to be challenged in court.
However, if you crash at a fogged-in airport because FSS and/or DUATS
report CAVU elsewhere, good luck trying to use those reports to defend
yourself.

Neil

"Dave A." wrote in message
news:hzCle.4554$Fb.1419@trndny07...
The philosophizing on the subject aside, all indications given by the FAA
is that the FSS and DUATS weather and NOTAMS are your only proof should
legal proceedings take place that you followed 91.103.

FSS and DUATS are the only services whose use is supposed to generate
*automatic* proof of the briefing, with no further effort on your part. But
if you get the same information elsewhere, you *may* still be able to prove
that you did so (witnesses, notes, saved or deleted data on your computer,
etc.).

--Gary

"George Patterson" wrote in message
news:x2xle.2405$Lb.1000@trndny05...
Dave Stadt wrote:

So you would launch if actual conditions were below minimums but FSS said
things were OK. Interesting, but not condusive to a long life.

I think he meant the other way 'round.

Thanks George, thought I was going crazy.


--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot

-I can gather all the news I need
on the weather report-

When I was based at Kupper, the nearest
reporting station was Newark. Newark's on the coast and frequently has IMC
when Kupper is VFR. I remember an FAA inspector telling a safety meeting
group that we were technically illegal if we flew VFR when EWR was IFR. I
don't think any of us changed our habits as a result of that statement. I
certainly didn't.

George Patterson
Why do men's hearts beat faster, knees get weak, throats become dry,
and they think irrationally when a woman wears leather clothing?
Because she smells like a new truck.

So you would launch if actual conditions were below minimums but FSS said
things were OK. Interesting, but not condusive to a long life.


No no, other way around.

--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot

-I can gather all the news I need
on the weather report-

"Dave Stadt" wrote in message
...

"Dave A." wrote in message
news:fcwle.3544$zb.3181@trndny01...
Actual conditions outrank FSS or DUATS. Think about it.

I did. Then I remembered lawyers.


--
Dave A
Aging Student Pilot

-I can gather all the news I need
on the weather report-