TRSA and /X

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...

They are left-over from when Class C airspace was called an ARSA.


Actually, they're left over from an even earlier time.



The main difference between an ARSA and a TRSA was that the former
required participation, while the latter did not. Then, and now, the TRSA
is sort of "in-between" Class C (mandatory radar services) and Class D
(no radar services).


TRSAs provide a service in-between Class C service and Basic Radar service.
There are some terminal radar facilities that do not have Class B or Class C
airspace and are not TRSAs, these facilities provide Basic Radar service.

http://makeashorterlink.com/?R22812C3B



The bottom line here is that TRSAs exist where there's a terminal radar
facility (approach/departure control), but where there's not enough
traffic to justify mandatory participation (as is the case for Class C, or
Class B for that matter).


But TRSAs do not exist at all such locations. Facilities that provide Basic
Radar service are identified on sectional charts by a small blue circle with
an R in it near the airport name.

http://makeashorterlink.com/?F3E722C3B



It's really just Class E airspace, where radar
services are being provided by a terminal controller rather than a center
(enroute) controller (that's a bit of an oversimplification too, but it's
the basic idea).


It's Class D and Class E airspace.



The boundaries show you where the terminal controller provides the radar
services rather than the center controller. The only difference in radar
services is who is providing them; it's still just your run-of-the-mill
Class E services, which are optional wherever you are.


That's not correct. The charted TRSA boundary is well within the
center/approach boundary. The terminal facility provides services on both
sides of the TRSA boundary, probably by the same controller as well.

Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but according to the AIM, TRSAs provide
separation between participating VFR aircraft. In class C airspace, there
is only separation between VFR & IFR aircraft. The AIM makes it sound like
TRSAs offer participating aircraft a higher level of separation services
than class C radar services.


"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Peter Duniho" wrote in message
...

They are left-over from when Class C airspace was called an ARSA.


Actually, they're left over from an even earlier time.



The main difference between an ARSA and a TRSA was that the former
required participation, while the latter did not. Then, and now, the
TRSA
is sort of "in-between" Class C (mandatory radar services) and Class D
(no radar services).


TRSAs provide a service in-between Class C service and Basic Radar
service.
There are some terminal radar facilities that do not have Class B or Class
C
airspace and are not TRSAs, these facilities provide Basic Radar service.

http://makeashorterlink.com/?R22812C3B



The bottom line here is that TRSAs exist where there's a terminal radar
facility (approach/departure control), but where there's not enough
traffic to justify mandatory participation (as is the case for Class C,
or
Class B for that matter).


But TRSAs do not exist at all such locations. Facilities that provide
Basic
Radar service are identified on sectional charts by a small blue circle
with
an R in it near the airport name.

http://makeashorterlink.com/?F3E722C3B



It's really just Class E airspace, where radar
services are being provided by a terminal controller rather than a center
(enroute) controller (that's a bit of an oversimplification too, but it's
the basic idea).


It's Class D and Class E airspace.



The boundaries show you where the terminal controller provides the radar
services rather than the center controller. The only difference in radar
services is who is providing them; it's still just your run-of-the-mill
Class E services, which are optional wherever you are.


That's not correct. The charted TRSA boundary is well within the
center/approach boundary. The terminal facility provides services on both
sides of the TRSA boundary, probably by the same controller as well.

"Brad Zeigler" wrote in message
...

Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but according to the AIM, TRSAs provide
separation between participating VFR aircraft. In class C airspace, there
is only separation between VFR & IFR aircraft. The AIM makes it sound
like TRSAs offer participating aircraft a higher level of separation
services than class C radar services.


I suppose that depends on what you consider a higher level of separation
services to be. In Class C airspace IFR aircraft are separated from all
other aircraft, but in TRSAs they're only separated from other participating
aircraft.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Brad Zeigler" wrote in message
...

Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but according to the AIM, TRSAs provide
separation between participating VFR aircraft. In class C airspace,
there is only separation between VFR & IFR aircraft. The AIM makes it
sound like TRSAs offer participating aircraft a higher level of
separation services than class C radar services.


I suppose that depends on what you consider a higher level of separation
services to be. In Class C airspace IFR aircraft are separated from all
other aircraft, but in TRSAs they're only separated from other
participating aircraft.

True. I was thinking along the lines of VFR to VFR separation. Manditory
participation in class C doesn't get you that...only Class B. It's
interesting that TRSAs offer VFR to VFR separation, even if only for those
who wish to play along. Perhaps this is an attribute of TRSAs that
differentiate themselves from Class Ds with approach radar services.

Brad Zeigler wrote:

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Brad Zeigler" wrote in message
...

Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but according to the AIM, TRSAs provide
separation between participating VFR aircraft. In class C airspace,
there is only separation between VFR & IFR aircraft. The AIM makes it
sound like TRSAs offer participating aircraft a higher level of
separation services than class C radar services.


I suppose that depends on what you consider a higher level of separation
services to be. In Class C airspace IFR aircraft are separated from all
other aircraft, but in TRSAs they're only separated from other
participating aircraft.


True. I was thinking along the lines of VFR to VFR separation. Manditory
participation in class C doesn't get you that...only Class B. It's
interesting that TRSAs offer VFR to VFR separation, even if only for those
who wish to play along. Perhaps this is an attribute of TRSAs that
differentiate themselves from Class Ds with approach radar services.

The use of approach radar services at (at least some) airports in Class
D with approach radar services (but no TRSA) is optional too. You can
decline them if you so desire e.g. at KRDG, although tower will point
you to the approach frequency if you don't explicitly decline it.

At KRDG the approach position is actually in the tower cab anyway. Off
peak, the same controller might be approach, tower, ground, and
clearance delivery simultaneously.