DUAT

"Newps" wrote in message
news


Stan Prevost wrote:



It seems to be to everyone's advantage for the pilot to report being OTP
as soon as he is and can remain that way, even if that is on the runway,
as newps described, or on initial contact with Departure. That minimizes
the time and space during which I must be provided separation, as long as
I am willing to forego that.

If you report it prior to departure the tower controller can amend your
clearance in the computer and this will save a landline call to the
center. Once you tag up on the radar the tower/departure controller loses
the ability to make changes in the computer, only the center can do it.

Interesting. I never heard that before. So a TRACON controller cannot
change a clearance without calling center to do it?

"Stan Prevost" wrote in message
...

Interesting. I never heard that before. So a TRACON controller cannot
change a clearance without calling center to do it?


It's a flight data processing issue. A terminal controller cannot amend a
flight plan in the computer if the host center has auto-acquired a target on
that flight. The revised clearance must then be manually coordinated. The
alternative is to suspend the auto-acquire feature, which will then require
the center to manually start a track on aircraft that depart from airports
where the center provides approach control services. Suspending the
auto-acquire is the way to go, starting a track is quick and easy and is
more than made up for by the reduced manual coordination.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
.net...

"Stan Prevost" wrote in message
...

Interesting. I never heard that before. So a TRACON controller cannot
change a clearance without calling center to do it?


It's a flight data processing issue. A terminal controller cannot amend a
flight plan in the computer if the host center has auto-acquired a target
on that flight. The revised clearance must then be manually coordinated.
The alternative is to suspend the auto-acquire feature, which will then
require the center to manually start a track on aircraft that depart from
airports where the center provides approach control services. Suspending
the auto-acquire is the way to go, starting a track is quick and easy and
is more than made up for by the reduced manual coordination.


So this becomes an issue only at a towered field using center approach
control services?

"Stan Prevost" wrote in message
...

So this becomes an issue only at a towered field using center approach
control services?


No, it's an issue at any field using center approach control services and
pop-ups in center airspace.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
nk.net...

"Stan Prevost" wrote in message
...

So this becomes an issue only at a towered field using center approach
control services?


No, it's an issue at any field using center approach control services and
pop-ups in center airspace.



I don't understand. Your prior discussion was in the context of a terminal
controller and center approach control, I thought. That's why I was trying
to clarify that it applied to a towered field using center approach control.

Can the terminal controller suspend auto-acquire?

If there is not a terminal controller, does center suspend auto-acquire?

Is suspending auto-acquire done on a per-acft basis?

Stan Prevost wrote:



I don't understand. Your prior discussion was in the context of a terminal
controller and center approach control, I thought. That's why I was trying
to clarify that it applied to a towered field using center approach control.

It's affects any computer not located at a center. It does not matter
what service a center provides or doesn't provide.


Can the terminal controller suspend auto-acquire?

Yes but this isn't ever done because I don't know when you are going to
make your request. It might be 20 miles after takeoff.

"Stan Prevost" wrote in message
...

I don't understand. Your prior discussion was in the context of a
terminal controller and center approach control, I thought. That's why I
was trying to clarify that it applied to a towered field using center
approach control.


I believe you're thinking of terminal controllers as strictly tower
controllers. Terminal controllers are those working in control towers and
approach control facilities.

What exactly were you asking when you wrote, "So this becomes an issue only
at a towered field using center approach control services?" I took it to
mean the auto-acquire of tracks by ARTCCs. Tracks auto-acquire wherever
they happen to be if they're observed by center secondary radar when
beginning their flight.



Can the terminal controller suspend auto-acquire?


Can the terminal controller suspend the auto-acquire of targets by the
center? No, of course not.



If there is not a terminal controller, does center suspend auto-acquire?


No, there'd be no reason to in that case.



Is suspending auto-acquire done on a per-acft basis?


No, it's done center-wide.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
link.net...

"Stan Prevost" wrote in message
...

I don't understand. Your prior discussion was in the context of a
terminal controller and center approach control, I thought. That's why I
was trying to clarify that it applied to a towered field using center
approach control.


I believe you're thinking of terminal controllers as strictly tower
controllers. Terminal controllers are those working in control towers and
approach control facilities.


That's how I normally think of terminal controllers. But I thought you had
excluded the approach control facilities when you used the context of fields
using center approach control.

Do you call center controllers "terminal controllers" when they are working
approach control? That could be what I missed.


What exactly were you asking when you wrote, "So this becomes an issue
only at a towered field using center approach control services?" I took
it to mean the auto-acquire of tracks by ARTCCs. Tracks auto-acquire
wherever they happen to be if they're observed by center secondary radar
when beginning their flight.


I no longer think I understand anything about this discussion of under what
circumstances a controller can change a flight plan. I need to find a new
starting point, or just abandon it. It seems to be an obscure issue for
pilots, I was just curious when it came up.

Thanks.

Stan Prevost wrote:



So this becomes an issue only at a towered field using center approach
control services?

No it's an issue for any TRACON. All computer systems run thru the
center computer. They set the paramters. Right now whenever you
takeoff and tag up on the radar I lose the ability to make changes to
your flightplan thru the computer. I have to call the center controller
on the landline. We are in the process of having that changed with Salt
Lake. Both them and us here at BIL don't like this needless
coordination so we are changing it.

"Newps" wrote in message
...

No it's an issue for any TRACON.


No, it's only an issue for TRACONs hosted by centers that use auto-acquire.