WW-II rocket motor on E-bay - opinions ?

Gord Beaman wrote:

"miket6065" wrote:
snip

Probably was
that the pilot didn't have a direct linkage to the engine. It seems
in the wings were the flight engineers and the pilot spoke into
speaking tubes
giving orders about power settings. This was almost as dangerous as
the
glider idea and Karl complained bitterly. Finally the pilot had
some direct power control on the engines.


I doubt that this is correct...on the Canadian ASW aircraft (the
Argus) the pilots didn't operate the engines either, they never
touched them, and we flew that aircraft for over twenty years
with the flight engineers operating them...no accident was ever
attributed to that fact.

Gord, good to see that you're still here!
The B-36 was also an FE-oriented airplane. The pilots had a set of
coarse throttles, but all the fiddling and fine adjustment was done
by the FEs (later models had 2 on duty at any given time). Of
course, they had a lot to do - 6 engines, 6 props, 2
turbosuperchargers/engine, multispeed cooling fans (Which would chew
up 200 hp/engine if you set 'em wrong) and, if they had nothing
better to do, they could go out into the wing & change out the
accessory sections.
BTW, I just noted a new book in one of the local shops in the making
of "The Dambusters" - lots of beautiful shots of Lancasters, both
inside & out, from about your era - (Mid '50s). I think the Statute
of Limitations is off now, so - after the movie came out, you guys
weren't, uhm, taking the opportunity to practice chasing down the
local lakes at 60', were you? (Just in case they needed to make the
sequel, after all).

Oh, yeah - the John Wayne estate's just released one of his better
movies, after sitting on it for a couple of decades- "Island in the
Sky". It's the story of a C-47 (Captained by John Wayne) on the
North Atlantic Run (Preque Isle, Gander/Goose, Bluie West 1,
Reykavik, Prestwick) forced down somewhere in Labrador or
Newfoundland during Winter, and the search for the missing plane. It
was adapted by Ernie Gann from his novel of the same name, which is
based on events that actually happened while Gann was a Civil
Contract pilot on the North Atlantic Run. The film was directed by
Lafayette Escadrille veteran William Wyler - so it's got Authentic
Aviation through the roof. It's damned good, and not your typical
John Wayne movie. (And Wyler's presence shows that while Bomber
Pilots make History, Fighter Pilots _do_ make movies.)
I caught it on cable, but I understand it's also being released on
DVD.


--
Pete Stickney
Java Man knew nothing about coffee.

Peter Stickney wrote in news:iaens2-sk7.ln1
@adelphia.net:

Oh, yeah - the John Wayne estate's just released one of his better
movies, after sitting on it for a couple of decades- "Island in the
Sky".

snip
I caught it on cable, but I understand it's also being released on
DVD.


Yes, it is in my Netflix queue (DVD)--today shows as "short wait", which in
theory means they have some in stock out to members, but are falling a
little short of user demand.

Peter A. Stoll

Peter Stickney wrote:

Gord Beaman wrote:

"miket6065" wrote:
snip

Probably was
that the pilot didn't have a direct linkage to the engine. It seems
in the wings were the flight engineers and the pilot spoke into
speaking tubes
giving orders about power settings. This was almost as dangerous as
the
glider idea and Karl complained bitterly. Finally the pilot had
some direct power control on the engines.


I doubt that this is correct...on the Canadian ASW aircraft (the
Argus) the pilots didn't operate the engines either, they never
touched them, and we flew that aircraft for over twenty years
with the flight engineers operating them...no accident was ever
attributed to that fact.

Gord, good to see that you're still here!
The B-36 was also an FE-oriented airplane. The pilots had a set of
coarse throttles, but all the fiddling and fine adjustment was done
by the FEs (later models had 2 on duty at any given time). Of
course, they had a lot to do - 6 engines, 6 props, 2
turbosuperchargers/engine, multispeed cooling fans (Which would chew
up 200 hp/engine if you set 'em wrong) and, if they had nothing
better to do, they could go out into the wing & change out the
accessory sections.

Thanks Peter, U2. and yes, I have a book on the B-36...wooHoo!
quite the machine indeed, very impressive...D R O N E !... what a
sound they made when flying over...make your chest vibrate...

BTW, I just noted a new book in one of the local shops in the making
of "The Dambusters" - lots of beautiful shots of Lancasters, both
inside & out, from about your era - (Mid '50s). I think the Statute
of Limitations is off now, so - after the movie came out, you guys
weren't, uhm, taking the opportunity to practice chasing down the
local lakes at 60', were you? (Just in case they needed to make the
sequel, after all).


Sure! that's why we did it!, just to be ready.

I have 575 hours in the Lanc and I almost don't dare say what I
think of that a/c because it was loved by so many. Well, it
certainly did do yeoman service during the war but in actuality
it was a damned dangerous machine. I was in 405 (MR) Squadron in
the early fifties for 5 years. We had, I think about 10 of them
and we lost 6 in those 5 years (lots of lives lost as well). Just
for comparison, we had, I think, 33 Argus for over 20 years and
only lost 2.

The damned Lanc had a terrifically high lift wing (for those
humongous bombloads) and a very far forward mounted MLG plus very
soft oleos and large soft tires. This added up to a ticklish a/c
to land. Put it 'on' the slightest bit firmly and it'd BOUNCE.

The soft tires and oleos, placed so far forward would ram the
nose UP and that tremendously powerful wing would snap you up a
hundred feet almost instantly, then you'd gingerly but quickly
try to add a bit of power to ease the 'second coming'...I've seen
many three or more bounce attempts, each worse than the preceding
till you're outta runway so you pork on full power at the top of
the last bounce and 'go around'... I've got a bunch of those hair
raisers...quite scary indeed.


Oh, yeah - the John Wayne estate's just released one of his better
movies, after sitting on it for a couple of decades- "Island in the
Sky". It's the story of a C-47 (Captained by John Wayne) on the
North Atlantic Run (Preque Isle, Gander/Goose, Bluie West 1,
Reykavik, Prestwick) forced down somewhere in Labrador or
Newfoundland during Winter, and the search for the missing plane. It
was adapted by Ernie Gann from his novel of the same name, which is
based on events that actually happened while Gann was a Civil
Contract pilot on the North Atlantic Run. The film was directed by
Lafayette Escadrille veteran William Wyler - so it's got Authentic
Aviation through the roof. It's damned good, and not your typical
John Wayne movie. (And Wyler's presence shows that while Bomber
Pilots make History, Fighter Pilots _do_ make movies.)
I caught it on cable, but I understand it's also being released on
DVD.

Thanks Peter...I'll pick em up!...BTW, remember that awful film
about the Gimli Glider?. I have the book and the true story as
well.

I really admire the Capt, I think that he did one hell of a job
in getting that thing down with no fatalities (even though the
whole incident was his fault). Anyway, Capt Pearson has a sail
boat here at the Silver Fox Yacht club in Summerside and I was
lucky enough to meet him and shake his hand and congratulate him
on the fine job.

He was an honest gentleman and said "Well, I pretty damned well
HAD to get them outta trouble, after all it was all my fault in
the first place" . I had to agree with him, and did. Nice
chap.
--

-Gord.
(use gordon in email)

Gord,

Many years ago, I flew into Hamilton, I believe Mount something or other to
fly an airshow. Got in a few days in early as I had friends in Toronto. 1st
day there, I got to go up in the Canadian Warbird Heritage Museum's Lanc.
No stick time but did notice the high wing lift and the landing we made has
a very long roll out. The pilot explained to me that the gear and tires we
a bit touchy on landings.

If I recall, they lost that bird in a mishap.

Jake

"Gord Beaman" wrote in message
...
Peter Stickney wrote:

Gord Beaman wrote:

"miket6065" wrote:
snip

Probably was
that the pilot didn't have a direct linkage to the engine. It seems
in the wings were the flight engineers and the pilot spoke into
speaking tubes
giving orders about power settings. This was almost as dangerous as
the
glider idea and Karl complained bitterly. Finally the pilot had
some direct power control on the engines.


I doubt that this is correct...on the Canadian ASW aircraft (the
Argus) the pilots didn't operate the engines either, they never
touched them, and we flew that aircraft for over twenty years
with the flight engineers operating them...no accident was ever
attributed to that fact.

Gord, good to see that you're still here!
The B-36 was also an FE-oriented airplane. The pilots had a set of
coarse throttles, but all the fiddling and fine adjustment was done
by the FEs (later models had 2 on duty at any given time). Of
course, they had a lot to do - 6 engines, 6 props, 2
turbosuperchargers/engine, multispeed cooling fans (Which would chew
up 200 hp/engine if you set 'em wrong) and, if they had nothing
better to do, they could go out into the wing & change out the
accessory sections.

Thanks Peter, U2. and yes, I have a book on the B-36...wooHoo!
quite the machine indeed, very impressive...D R O N E !... what a
sound they made when flying over...make your chest vibrate...

BTW, I just noted a new book in one of the local shops in the making
of "The Dambusters" - lots of beautiful shots of Lancasters, both
inside & out, from about your era - (Mid '50s). I think the Statute
of Limitations is off now, so - after the movie came out, you guys
weren't, uhm, taking the opportunity to practice chasing down the
local lakes at 60', were you? (Just in case they needed to make the
sequel, after all).


Sure! that's why we did it!, just to be ready.

I have 575 hours in the Lanc and I almost don't dare say what I
think of that a/c because it was loved by so many. Well, it
certainly did do yeoman service during the war but in actuality
it was a damned dangerous machine. I was in 405 (MR) Squadron in
the early fifties for 5 years. We had, I think about 10 of them
and we lost 6 in those 5 years (lots of lives lost as well). Just
for comparison, we had, I think, 33 Argus for over 20 years and
only lost 2.

The damned Lanc had a terrifically high lift wing (for those
humongous bombloads) and a very far forward mounted MLG plus very
soft oleos and large soft tires. This added up to a ticklish a/c
to land. Put it 'on' the slightest bit firmly and it'd BOUNCE.

The soft tires and oleos, placed so far forward would ram the
nose UP and that tremendously powerful wing would snap you up a
hundred feet almost instantly, then you'd gingerly but quickly
try to add a bit of power to ease the 'second coming'...I've seen
many three or more bounce attempts, each worse than the preceding
till you're outta runway so you pork on full power at the top of
the last bounce and 'go around'... I've got a bunch of those hair
raisers...quite scary indeed.


Oh, yeah - the John Wayne estate's just released one of his better
movies, after sitting on it for a couple of decades- "Island in the
Sky". It's the story of a C-47 (Captained by John Wayne) on the
North Atlantic Run (Preque Isle, Gander/Goose, Bluie West 1,
Reykavik, Prestwick) forced down somewhere in Labrador or
Newfoundland during Winter, and the search for the missing plane. It
was adapted by Ernie Gann from his novel of the same name, which is
based on events that actually happened while Gann was a Civil
Contract pilot on the North Atlantic Run. The film was directed by
Lafayette Escadrille veteran William Wyler - so it's got Authentic
Aviation through the roof. It's damned good, and not your typical
John Wayne movie. (And Wyler's presence shows that while Bomber
Pilots make History, Fighter Pilots _do_ make movies.)
I caught it on cable, but I understand it's also being released on
DVD.

Thanks Peter...I'll pick em up!...BTW, remember that awful film
about the Gimli Glider?. I have the book and the true story as
well.

I really admire the Capt, I think that he did one hell of a job
in getting that thing down with no fatalities (even though the
whole incident was his fault). Anyway, Capt Pearson has a sail
boat here at the Silver Fox Yacht club in Summerside and I was
lucky enough to meet him and shake his hand and congratulate him
on the fine job.

He was an honest gentleman and said "Well, I pretty damned well
HAD to get them outta trouble, after all it was all my fault in
the first place" . I had to agree with him, and did. Nice
chap.
--

-Gord.
(use gordon in email)

"JD" wrote:


Many years ago, I flew into Hamilton, I believe Mount something or other to
fly an airshow. Got in a few days in early as I had friends in Toronto. 1st
day there, I got to go up in the Canadian Warbird Heritage Museum's Lanc.
No stick time but did notice the high wing lift and the landing we made has
a very long roll out. The pilot explained to me that the gear and tires we
a bit touchy on landings.

If I recall, they lost that bird in a mishap.

Jake

Well, I don't think we lost it Jake (I certainly hope not at
least). That's the Mynarski Lanc and it's one of the last two
flyable Lancasters left in the world. The other one is in
England. You're quite lucky to have gotten a 'flip' in it sir!...
--

-Gord.
(use gordon in email)

In article ,
(Gord Beaman) wrote:

Thanks Peter, U2. and yes, I have a book on the B-36...wooHoo!
quite the machine indeed, very impressive...D R O N E !... what a
sound they made when flying over...make your chest vibrate...

Wonder if there's anyone around who's heard both a B-36 and a Tu-95 Bear?
That's supposed to have a very distinctive sound, but I've never seen or
heard one.

The damned Lanc had a terrifically high lift wing (for those
humongous bombloads) and a very far forward mounted MLG plus very
soft oleos and large soft tires. This added up to a ticklish a/c
to land. Put it 'on' the slightest bit firmly and it'd BOUNCE.

Yeow... Since I read about them, I've suspected one of the bravest Lanc
crews were the team that test-flew each one for the first time at the Avro
factory. They were doing six or seven a day for much of WWII.

---
John Dallman, , HTML mail is treated as probable spam.

On Wed, 10 Aug 2005 20:50 +0100 (BST), (John Dallman)
wrote:

In article ,
(Gord Beaman) wrote:

Thanks Peter, U2. and yes, I have a book on the B-36...wooHoo!
quite the machine indeed, very impressive...D R O N E !... what a
sound they made when flying over...make your chest vibrate...

Wonder if there's anyone around who's heard both a B-36 and a Tu-95 Bear?
That's supposed to have a very distinctive sound, but I've never seen or
heard one.

hand enthusiastically raised ME! ME! ME! :-)

When I was in grade school back in the '50s in Joliet, IL a flight of
B-36's went over. Time has dimmed a lot about the event (including
the precise number of aircraft). But it was an IMPRESSIVE sound. It
was also the first time I had heard the term "aluminum overcast." ;-)

When deployed aboard INTREPID in '71 we were overflown by Bears from
time to time. It was a distinct sound, different from any turboprop
I'd heard before.

The damned Lanc had a terrifically high lift wing (for those
humongous bombloads) and a very far forward mounted MLG plus very
soft oleos and large soft tires. This added up to a ticklish a/c
to land. Put it 'on' the slightest bit firmly and it'd BOUNCE.

Yeow... Since I read about them, I've suspected one of the bravest Lanc
crews were the team that test-flew each one for the first time at the Avro
factory. They were doing six or seven a day for much of WWII.

That would add up to real "pucker factor" by about tea time! :-)

Bill Kambic

"John Dallman" wrote in message
...
In article ,
(Gord Beaman) wrote:



Yeow... Since I read about them, I've suspected one of the bravest Lanc
crews were the team that test-flew each one for the first time at the Avro
factory. They were doing six or seven a day for much of WWII.


Not to mention the women who flew them from the factories
to the front line squadron bases. I recall one RAF erk telling me
of the surprise he got when one landed and 2 very pretty girls
got out. He was still waiting for the air crew when he realised
they were the pilot and flight engineer.

Keith



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