Touch and Goes versus Full Stop Taxi Backs

"Dudley Henriques" dhenriques@noware .net wrote in message
link.net...
The subject of touch and gos in the student scenario has been a long time
pro and con issue in the industry and the answers will vary . ...snip...
Personally, from a flight instructor's point of view, I initially prefer
full stop landings with primary students, then possibly touch and gos
later along the learning curve as conditions dictate or permit.

Dudley Henriques



My (fairly large) school has a blanket policy of *no* T & G for student
solo.

Dual, they will have you practice landings T & G pretty much right from the
beginning.... but the right seat always handles the flaps. In a 172, I
don't find a great trim difference between TO position, and 65-knot-landing
position, as mention by another post. Trim adjustment is not a big deal.

I anticipated that somewhere along the line they would let me do full T & G,
at least dual, but it has never come up, and I am nearing checkride time
(well...:, maybe...). So it would have to be something I'd have to
specifically request of the instructor...

"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...
On 2005-09-12, Kevin Dunlevy wrote:

With tailwheel planes or with aircraft with retractible gear, I always
do stop-and-goes.

As I understand it, with a tailwheel, you cannot count a touch-and-go as a
landing, anyway, for the purpose of logging (currency).... or is that just
in Canada?

"Icebound" wrote in message
...

"Dudley Henriques" dhenriques@noware .net wrote in message
link.net...
The subject of touch and gos in the student scenario has been a long time
pro and con issue in the industry and the answers will vary . ...snip...
Personally, from a flight instructor's point of view, I initially prefer
full stop landings with primary students, then possibly touch and gos
later along the learning curve as conditions dictate or permit.

Dudley Henriques



My (fairly large) school has a blanket policy of *no* T & G for student
solo.

Dual, they will have you practice landings T & G pretty much right from
the beginning.... but the right seat always handles the flaps. In a 172,
I don't find a great trim difference between TO position, and
65-knot-landing position, as mention by another post. Trim adjustment is
not a big deal.

I anticipated that somewhere along the line they would let me do full T &
G, at least dual, but it has never come up, and I am nearing checkride
time (well...:, maybe...). So it would have to be something I'd have to
specifically request of the instructor...

All I can tell you based on what you have said here is that your school uses
methods I would never recommend, and have never used myself. I guess this is
why there are different methods being used out there :-)
Dudley Henriques

Dylan Smith wrote:

On 2005-09-12, Jim Burns wrote:

completing their checklists, and following procedures. Touch and gos can
prematurely lead the pilot into the takeoff phase when the landing phase
hasn't been completed. This gets increasingly important as the pilot
transitions to heavier, faster, and more complex airplanes.


Try a touch and go in a Boeing 737 - you've never been so busy. What
really concentrates the mind is the runway rushing by as you hurtle down it
in excess of 100 knots! (I've only done it in a B737 sim which was
exciting enough)

Boeing stops by here regularly with all the new planes....737's, 767's,
777's, 787's, etc. They do downwind ILS's(15 knot minimum tailwind) and
do touch and goes back to more ILS's. They do this for hours at a time.

I do T&Gs in light twins. I don't think the work load is that much more
than in a 172. One lands using the regular checklist. When landing one
normally looks ahead to the potential need for a go-around anyway. In a
T&G one then touches down and proceeds to go around. Once back in the
air the normal takeoff checklist plus retract the flaps. Then there is
plenty of time in the circuit to think and prepare for the next landing
or T&G.


Jim Burns wrote:
There will come a day when you'll want to fly something that is
not so docile as a Cherokee or a 172. When that day comes, you'll be
prepared to follow the checklists and may avoid an unrecoverable mistake.

On Sun, 11 Sep 2005 20:30:44 -0600, Newps wrote:



buttman wrote:

If I'm in a bonanza, I'll do full stop, as there are a lot of things
you have to do (gear, etc),

??? Putting the gear back down after skidding to a stop?

Not required if you don't mind using full power for the taxi back.
;-)

Klein

Icebound wrote:
"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...

On 2005-09-12, Kevin Dunlevy wrote:

With tailwheel planes or with aircraft with retractible gear, I always
do stop-and-goes.


As I understand it, with a tailwheel, you cannot count a touch-and-go as a
landing, anyway, for the purpose of logging (currency).... or is that just
in Canada?

No, I believe the requirement in the US is that you have to have three
full-stop landings in the past 90 days (in a tailwheel plane).

Personally, I seem to have the biggest problem (when I haven't flown in
the past week or so) with the last 10 feet or so, at least on those real
bumpy days... once I'm planted on the ground I do a lot better. Maybe
it was just from riding right seat one day when the guy in the left
brought us down so hard we bent a gear leg a bit and destroyed the leg
fairing and wheel pants. Anyways, I can't do full-stall landings for
beans, though wheel landings aren't too bad (airplane handles much nicer
at 75-80). Therefore, T&G is easy; just push the throttle up, get
airborne, and retract the flaps before passing 100. No carb heat to
worry about, there's plenty of power, and the flaps are manual
(hand-brake style) so they come up real quick if you need them. I don't
mess with the flaps on the ground as I'm trying hard enough just to keep
going straight.

Interesting,
We always do taxi backs. And stall landings are what the CFI likes to
see. I'm getting pretty good at them. I don't really find them that
hard...pretty much a matter of having that "right" sight picture. Myself I
do believe in a taildragger the taxi backs are very crucial , especially
during training. It does seem to teach the taildragger " fly the airplane"
from the time the prop turns until it stops. I can easily see how someone
who has flown tri-gears and no tailwheel , may would have a problem with
the taildragger. There really isn't much relaxing going on when you taxi a
taildragger back for another takeoff. Can't relax to much from my
experience, keep the stick back , watch your taxi speed , may have to dance
with those feet alittle But heck they are alot of fun though !

Patrick
student SP
aircraft structural mech


"Bob Martin" wrote in message
...
Icebound wrote:
"Dylan Smith" wrote in message
...

On 2005-09-12, Kevin Dunlevy wrote:

With tailwheel planes or with aircraft with retractible gear, I always
do stop-and-goes.


As I understand it, with a tailwheel, you cannot count a touch-and-go as
a landing, anyway, for the purpose of logging (currency).... or is that
just in Canada?

No, I believe the requirement in the US is that you have to have three
full-stop landings in the past 90 days (in a tailwheel plane).

Personally, I seem to have the biggest problem (when I haven't flown in
the past week or so) with the last 10 feet or so, at least on those real
bumpy days... once I'm planted on the ground I do a lot better. Maybe it
was just from riding right seat one day when the guy in the left brought
us down so hard we bent a gear leg a bit and destroyed the leg fairing and
wheel pants. Anyways, I can't do full-stall landings for beans, though
wheel landings aren't too bad (airplane handles much nicer at 75-80).
Therefore, T&G is easy; just push the throttle up, get airborne, and
retract the flaps before passing 100. No carb heat to worry about,
there's plenty of power, and the flaps are manual (hand-brake style) so
they come up real quick if you need them. I don't mess with the flaps on
the ground as I'm trying hard enough just to keep going straight.

As I understand it, with a tailwheel, you cannot count a touch-and-go as a
landing, anyway, for the purpose of logging (currency).... or is that just
in Canada?


Day landings may be touch and go, night landings must be full stop.

W P Dixon wrote:

Can't
relax to much from my experience, keep the stick back , watch your taxi
speed , may have to dance with those feet alittle

Keep the stick forward if you have a tailwind. And keep the ailerons adjusted to
keep the upwind wing down.

With larger tailwheel aircraft, the position of the elevators depends more on
the amount of load than the wind. My Maule really didn't like aft yoke when
heavily loaded.

George Patterson
Give a person a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a person to
use the Internet and he won't bother you for weeks.