Debacle: Flight test of Diana-2

Chester D wrote:

There are plenty of glider pilots, even with 500 hours or more who
can`t handle performance gliders. They can in common situations like a
local flight but when in trouble the plane is too fast, too nervous,
just too hard for them to handle.

If a 500 hours pilot can't handle a certified (which means something,
handling wise) 15m glider, then he should quit gliding *immediately*.
Or, he oher way round: If a 15m glider is so nervous that a 200 hours
pilot (*any* 200 hours pilot!) can't handle it, then I wouldn't call it
"easy and safe to fly", which was my point.

Stefan

"Don Johnstone" wrote in
message

We are not talking open class here, the Diana is a
15 metre glider, unflapped with a claimed LD of
50.
Nothing special about that except the performance so
what is so difficult. I don't hear people saying that
a Discus (1 or 2) LS8 or any of the Scheilcher gliders
are anything but straightforward providing the pilot
has received the proper training.

Heres the rub, you said proper training.
The owner didn't let him fly.
There are conflicting reports on flying ability.
The owners, if they made a mistake, erred on the side of caution.
TOTALLY UNDERSTANDABLE ACTIONS.

The pilot who didn't fly is ****ed off and making a lot of noise about it.
TOTALLY UNDERSTANDABLE ACTIONS.

What I have a hard time with is the "tire kicker" rooting around
and using his OPINIONS to slap around a sailplane. If he has
technical issues of merit, he is doing us a favor by posting them, but
as most here can see., he is acting childishly and with vindictiveness.

I'm done here and hope everyone else is also..........

Hi Eric,

On Sun, 16 Oct 2005 20:48:49 -0700, Eric Greenwell
wrote:


Unless you are an engineer competent in composite design for crash
protection, I don't think you will learn anything about the design by
asking "where the Kevlar is".

Well... extremely light weight of a fuselage definitely makes me
wonder about crash protection - something Germany glider manufacturers
have a lot of experience with. I think there's a good cause why their
gliders are so heavy compared to the Diana 2.


I don't think any of the manufacturers test their gliders until they
flutter, because it is very dangerous.

Wilhelm Dirks did that with the DG-600...

Flutter testst are not performed inflight, but any aircraft needs to
perform static flutter tests before it's certified in Germany (a very
expensive thing to do - these tests are usually performed by Prfessor
Niedbal).

Even if the manufacturer the exact
flutter speed, he would be smart not to reveal that speed, for fear that
pilots would then use that speed as the "real" Vne.

The design maximum speed is Vne + 15 percent - this is what the glider
is designed for (and being flight-tested). Obviously this is the
proven speed where no flutter occurs... at least in a perfectly
maintained (prototype) glider.
I certainly wouldn't risk to fly that fast... do you think that
someone is so stupid to exceed Vne? I think most flutter cases happen
at speeds between Va and Vne due to unexpected turbulence.



Bye
Andreas

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 10:09:02 UTC, Stefan
wrote:

Hmmm... Now, you must decide: Is that glider (15m!) "easy and safe to
fly" or do you need more than 200 hours to be able to handle it?

200 hours in 1250 flights is quite suggestive, don't you think?

Ian


--

At 20:06 17 October 2005, Ian Johnston wrote:
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 10:09:02 UTC, Stefan
wrote:

Hmmm... Now, you must decide: Is that glider (15m!)
'easy and safe to
fly' or do you need more than 200 hours to be able
to handle it?

200 hours in 1250 flights is quite suggestive, don't
you think?

Ian

Sorry, I don't get it. Suggestive of what?

At 14:12 17 October 2005, Don Johnstone wrote:

We are not talking open class here, the Diana is a
15 metre glider, unflapped with a claimed LD of 50.

Nothing special about that except the performance so
what is so difficult. I don't hear people saying that
a Discus (1 or 2) LS8 or any of the Scheilcher gliders
are anything but straightforward providing the pilot
has received the proper training.

Don get your basic facts right matey - Diana is a FLAPPED
15m glider!!

At 14:12 17 October 2005, Don Johnstone wrote:

We are not talking open class here, the Diana is a
15 metre glider, unflapped with a claimed LD of 50.

Nothing special about that except the performance so
what is so difficult. I don't hear people saying that
a Discus (1 or 2) LS8 or any of the Scheilcher gliders
are anything but straightforward providing the pilot
has received the proper training.

Don get your basic facts right matey - Diana is a FLAPPED
15m glider!!

At 21:18 17 October 2005, Don Johnstone wrote:
At 20:06 17 October 2005, Ian Johnston wrote:
On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 10:09:02 UTC, Stefan
wrote:

Hmmm... Now, you must decide: Is that glider (15m!)
'easy and safe to
fly' or do you need more than 200 hours to be able
to handle it?

200 hours in 1250 flights is quite suggestive, don't
you think?

Ian

Sorry, I don't get it. Suggestive of what?

How about a crap soaring pilot..9.6 mins per launch,
sums things up somewhat

On 17 Oct 2005 20:02:50 GMT, Ian Johnston wrote:
fly" or do you need more than 200 hours to be able to handle it?
200 hours in 1250 flights is quite suggestive, don't you think?

This _might_ mean that he is instructing a lot.

Bartek

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 21:15:29 UTC, Don Johnstone
wrote:

At 20:06 17 October 2005, Ian Johnston wrote:

200 hours in 1250 flights is quite suggestive, don't
you think?

Sorry, I don't get it. Suggestive of what?

Quite a lot, really. 9 minutes 36 seconds per flight, on average.

Ian