Wind/Solar Electrics ???

"MSW is a shysters sales pitch which misrepresents the product. "

Are there deterministic tests that tell when a device has a "good
enough" sine wave?
Or is there some sort of accepted "spec"?

I saw in another post where one of the EU2000 hondas had a beautiful
"looking" wave form, but failed to run a furnace.

What can we use to "know for sure" that the wave form of a device is
adequate BEFORE buying it?

Thanks
Phil

philkryder wrote:

Are there deterministic tests that tell when a device has a "good
enough" sine wave? Or is there some sort of accepted "spec"?

I've seen a 5% total harmonic distortion spec. How many steps is that?

What can we use to "know for sure" that the wave form of a device is
adequate BEFORE buying it?

Try it out? I got a local dealer to start up an EU2000 and run it with
and without a muffler.

Nick

In article .com,
"philkryder" wrote:

"MSW is a shysters sales pitch which misrepresents the product. "

Are there deterministic tests that tell when a device has a "good
enough" sine wave?
Or is there some sort of accepted "spec"?

I saw in another post where one of the EU2000 hondas had a beautiful
"looking" wave form, but failed to run a furnace.

What can we use to "know for sure" that the wave form of a device is
adequate BEFORE buying it?

Thanks
Phil


You can use a college education in Electrical Engineering, and $40K
worth of test equipment, to "KNOW FOR SURE"...... or you can fool
around and see what works........ or you can ask one who already
did the previous, and figured it out, and then actually believe what
they tell you........ other than that your on your own......


Me

Yes this is the problem. While there are people who will tell you
anything to make a sale, how do you know what you are really getting.

One test is the "Modified Square Wave" test.

When you hear these words you know you are dealing either with a shyster
or an ignorant person who should not be selling things he does not
understand.

It is hard, what with a flood of imports at bargain basement prices.

Still, as long as people are willing to believe that a $59 3000W
"modified sine wave" inverter from Walmart, Cost Co, etc, etc has the
same specs as a $900 3000W sine inverter is, at best, fooling themselves.

I buy inverters from known manufacturers who are willing to provide spec
sheets that out line the full parameters of the inverter. You know
things like:

Efficiency curves
Max continuous output
1/2 hour rating
Surge
Standby
Max DC in

Well everything really.

I did build a kit inverter, once, years ago. It had a max rating of
150W, Which it met.

It had a half hour rating of 0W

And a surge of about 300W

Still it did the job it was built to do for many years.

Put your supplier on the spot. Tell them your load and buy on the
condition that what they are selling you will do what they claim or you
get a full refund, no questions asked.

philkryder wrote:
"MSW is a shysters sales pitch which misrepresents the product. "

Are there deterministic tests that tell when a device has a "good
enough" sine wave?
Or is there some sort of accepted "spec"?

I saw in another post where one of the EU2000 hondas had a beautiful
"looking" wave form, but failed to run a furnace.

What can we use to "know for sure" that the wave form of a device is
adequate BEFORE buying it?

Thanks
Phil

On Sat, 24 Dec 2005 09:31:50 +1100, George Ghio
wrote:


One test is the "Modified Square Wave" test.

When you hear these words you know you are dealing either with a shyster
or an ignorant person who should not be selling things he does not
understand.

The only thing your test proves is that you're irrationally
judgmental.

It is hard, what with a flood of imports at bargain basement prices.

Still, as long as people are willing to believe that a $59 3000W
"modified sine wave" inverter from Walmart, Cost Co, etc, etc has the
same specs as a $900 3000W sine inverter is, at best, fooling themselves.

Why do you give buyers so little credit? And where does one buy a
3000W sine-wave inverter for $900?

Wayne

George Ghio wrote:

I did build a kit inverter, once, years ago. It had a max rating of
150W, Which it met.

It had a half hour rating of 0W

And a surge of about 300W

I'm still scratching my head over that one.


NT

wrote:
George Ghio wrote:


I did build a kit inverter, once, years ago. It had a max rating of
150W, Which it met.

It had a half hour rating of 0W

And a surge of about 300W


I'm still scratching my head over that one.


NT


That's standard with george's posts. Don't get a splinter.

--
Steve Spence
Dir., Green Trust, http://www.green-trust.org
Contributing Editor, http://www.off-grid.net
http://www.rebelwolf.com/essn.html

Off your medication again Steve?

"Steve Spence" wrote in
message ...
wrote:
George Ghio wrote:


I did build a kit inverter, once, years ago. It had
a max rating of
150W, Which it met.

It had a half hour rating of 0W

And a surge of about 300W


I'm still scratching my head over that one.


NT


That's standard with george's posts. Don't get a
splinter.

--
Steve Spence
Dir., Green Trust, http://www.green-trust.org
Contributing Editor, http://www.off-grid.net
http://www.rebelwolf.com/essn.html

On 23 Dec 2005 23:57:27 -0800, wrote:

George Ghio wrote:

I did build a kit inverter, once, years ago. It had a max rating of
150W, Which it met.

It had a half hour rating of 0W

And a surge of about 300W

I'm still scratching my head over that one.


NT

He previously wrote about using either a 150 Ohm rheostat (other times
referred to as 150A or 200A), or 300k nichrome wire to control a few
Amps of field current on a small 12V automotive alternator. According
to the "designer" (who often refers to himself as a "solar power
consultant"), 150 Ohms didn't allow sufficiently low output, hence the
need for the nichrome wire. And as we all know, the prime
consideration on a home-power generator is low output. snorf Similar
wisdom surely underpins his other projects. For instance, liberal
application of 300k wire might be useful when building a max 150, peak
300, zero Watt inverter, or most any zero Watt inverter for that
matter. Perhaps strung around the property in large coils like razor
wire at Slinky Manor. ;-)

Wayne

wmbjk wrote:
On 23 Dec 2005 23:57:27 -0800, wrote:

George Ghio wrote:

I did build a kit inverter, once, years ago. It had a max rating of
150W, Which it met.

It had a half hour rating of 0W

And a surge of about 300W

I'm still scratching my head over that one.


NT

He previously wrote about using either a 150 Ohm rheostat (other times
referred to as 150A or 200A), or 300k nichrome wire to control a few
Amps of field current on a small 12V automotive alternator. According
to the "designer" (who often refers to himself as a "solar power
consultant"), 150 Ohms didn't allow sufficiently low output, hence the
need for the nichrome wire. And as we all know, the prime
consideration on a home-power generator is low output. snorf Similar
wisdom surely underpins his other projects. For instance, liberal
application of 300k wire might be useful when building a max 150, peak
300, zero Watt inverter, or most any zero Watt inverter for that
matter. Perhaps strung around the property in large coils like razor
wire at Slinky Manor. ;-)

Wayne

The trouble is he may actually BE a solar consultant. Nothing
stopping him afaik. At least not for a few years anyway.


NT