Newbie holding questions

In the real world, you'll probably never get to that fix without getting another
clearance limit unless

I suspect that we're tripping over "clearance limit". IF you got a
clearance that said hold at xxx VOR, expect flight planned route at
12:30 Zulu, you'd know what to do. If you arrived at xxx VOR after
12:30 Zulu, you'd never enter the hold. No delay.

If you got a clearance that said "cleared to xxx VOR, expect flight
planned route as soon as you arrive at xxx VOR", then you also know what
to do. Upon reaching xxx VOR NORDO, you'd never enter the hold. No delay.

But "expect flight planned route as soon as you arrive at xxx VOR" is
nonstandard phraseology. The proper way to say this is "expect no delay".

And there we are.

Jose
--
Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

On 01/11/06 11:44, Jose wrote:
In the real world, you'll probably never get to that fix without getting another
clearance limit unless

I suspect that we're tripping over "clearance limit". IF you got a
clearance that said hold at xxx VOR, expect flight planned route at
12:30 Zulu, you'd know what to do. If you arrived at xxx VOR after
12:30 Zulu, you'd never enter the hold. No delay.

Even if your radio is still working? I was taught to do what you say
*only* when the radio is not working.


If you got a clearance that said "cleared to xxx VOR, expect flight
planned route as soon as you arrive at xxx VOR", then you also know what
to do. Upon reaching xxx VOR NORDO, you'd never enter the hold. No delay.

But "expect flight planned route as soon as you arrive at xxx VOR" is
nonstandard phraseology. The proper way to say this is "expect no delay".

Okay. And if you arrive over the VOR (and are not NORDO and haven't received
any further clearance) you would need to hold - because this is your clearance
limit.


And there we are.

Jose


--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Sacramento, CA

"Mark Hansen" wrote in message
...

I suspect that we're tripping over "clearance limit". IF you got a
clearance that said hold at xxx VOR, expect flight planned route at 12:30
Zulu, you'd know what to do. If you arrived at xxx VOR after 12:30 Zulu,
you'd never enter the hold. No delay.


Even if your radio is still working? I was taught to do what you say
*only* when the radio is not working.


Were you ever specifically told what to do in that situation when the radio
is working?

Even if your radio is still working? I was taught to do what you say
*only* when the radio is not working.

The scenario was NORDO. If you have communication, you just ask.

Jose
--
Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

On 01/11/06 12:13, Jose wrote:
Even if your radio is still working? I was taught to do what you say
*only* when the radio is not working.

The scenario was NORDO. If you have communication, you just ask.

Jose

Okay, now we're going in circles ;-) I'll give up.


--
Mark Hansen, PP-ASEL, Instrument Airplane
Sacramento, CA

Okay, now we're going in circles ;-)

No.. it should be an oval. One minute legs...

Jose
--
Money: what you need when you run out of brains.
for Email, make the obvious change in the address.

"Steven P. McNicoll" wrote in message
ink.net...

"Mark Hansen" wrote in message
...

So it's impossible that the controller could be too busy to answer you,
or
that he got up to get some coffee?


Pretty much. How busy he's gonna be in the near future can be predicted
by the number of active and proposed strips sitting in front of him. He
ain't gonna take a coffee break without being relieved by another
controller.

This brings up an interesting trivia question. Do you controllers drink
coffee while working at the console and if so does someone bring it to you
during times when you can't take a break and get it for yourself? What's
the food and drink rule while working at the console?

"Ted" wrote in message
ink.net...

This brings up an interesting trivia question. Do you controllers drink
coffee while working at the console and if so does someone bring it to you
during times when you can't take a break and get it for yourself? What's
the food and drink rule while working at the console?


I don't drink coffee at work. It keeps me awake.

Rules like this come under facility policy. At Chicago Center beverages on
consoles were prohibited and small carts with cupholders were provided.
Coffee and soft drinks were available in the cafeteria there, I've been in
towers and TRACONs that had coffeemakers in the work areas.

Ted wrote:



This brings up an interesting trivia question. Do you controllers drink
coffee while working at the console and if so does someone bring it to you
during times when you can't take a break and get it for yourself? What's
the food and drink rule while working at the console?

Here we eat and drink on position at will. I don't drink coffee but I'm
never very far from a Mountain Dew. We have a refridgerator, microwave,
sink and a drawar full of plates and silverware in the tower cab as well
as the breakroom. If somebody's coming up you can have them bring you
something but you usually aren't on position long enough to have to
worry about that. During the midshift when you're alone I will just go
downstairs when there's no traffic to get something I need.

Newps wrote:
During the midshift when you're alone I will just go
downstairs when there's no traffic to get something I need.

Otherwise known as "on the landline"?

-R